Wolves / NBA:

Post by **trixR4kids** » Fri Jul 25 11:01 am

More interested to see how Doc Rivers handles the situation. That could be interesting.

Post by **Don Adams Wheel of Justice** » Fri Jul 25 12:09 pm

Get back to me when Doc Rivers and players start missing game checks for sitting out. All the player and coaches gestures so far (turning warmups inside out, leaving warmups in a ball at center court) have been pretty hollow.

It's easier to talk when it doesn't affect your pay check. Mr. Kluwe, I'm looking in your direction...

Post by **Slap Shot** » Sat Jul 26 9:58 am

Devil's Advocate thought on Donald Sterling:

Choke your coach, welcome back.
Assault a fan, welcome back.
Sexually assault someone and pay them off, welcome back.
Say something prejudicial in an illegally recorded conversation, banned for life.

Post by **Hammy** » Sat Jul 26 10:41 am

Let's be honest... the reason why Sterling is punished worse in those scenarios is the bulk of the players are African-American and a healthy chunk of fans are too. You start inciting negativity in those realms w/ prejudice (and potentially affecting your bottom line and league's brand), you act more harshly with discipline. I'm not saying it is right... just that it is what it is. All of those situations are bad.

Post by **dryfly** » Sat Jul 26 9:06 pm

Hammy wrote:Let's be honest... the reason why Sterling is punished worse in those scenarios is the bulk of the players are African-American and a healthy chunk of fans are too. You start inciting negativity in those realms w/ prejudice (and potentially affecting your bottom line and league's brand), you act more harshly with discipline. I'm not saying it is right... just that it is what it is. All of those situations are bad.

100% accurate. It is about the value of the brand... Big money. All those other things are 'individual' and don't affect the value of the brand.

Post by **trixR4kids** » Sun Jul 27 1:15 am

Slap Shot wrote:Devil's Advocate thought on Donald Sterling:

Choke your coach, welcome back.
Assault a fan, welcome back.
Sexually assault someone and pay them off, welcome back.
Say something prejudicial in an illegally recorded conversation, banned for life.

You have a point but those actions were by players not owners. I don't think it's unreasonable that owners should be held to higher standards. That said, fandom can be quite complex given the crap some of these guys pull (players, owners and everything in between).

Post by **Slap Shot** » Sun Jul 27 10:04 am

My angle was less about defending Sterling and more about NFL players getting off too easy.

Post by **Handyman** » Sun Jul 27 3:16 pm

trixR4kids wrote:
Slap Shot wrote:Devil's Advocate thought on Donald Sterling:

Choke your coach, welcome back.
Assault a fan, welcome back.
Sexually assault someone and pay them off, welcome back.
Say something prejudicial in an illegally recorded conversation, banned for life.

You have a point but those actions were by players not owners. I don't think it's unreasonable that owners should be held to higher standards. That said, fandom can be quite complex given the crap some of these guys pull (players, owners and everything in between).

If Sterling had done those things he would not be banned for life I guarantee that. He would have been lambasted, and ripped to shreds, but banned for life and forced to sell? Not a chance in hell...

dxmnkd316 · Post by **dxmnkd316** » Sun Jul 27 3:21 pm

As I understand it, it's not illegal as long as one of the parties knows it's being recorded. Just an FYI.

Post by **Handyman** » Sun Jul 27 3:22 pm

That depends on the state IIRC.

dxmnkd316 · Post by **dxmnkd316** » Sun Jul 27 3:24 pm

Right, and I believe that is California's law

Post by **team22tank** » Sun Jul 27 4:23 pm

Incorrect. CA is a two party consent state.
http://www.dmlp.org/legal-guide/california-recording-law

I have a hunch it won't be very easy getting old Don to say that he consented to the recording.
http://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/nba/clippers/2014/05/04/nba-donald-sterling-private-conversation/8693323/

Post by **Bigbeer** » Sun Jul 27 10:33 pm

Slap Shot wrote:Devil's Advocate thought on Donald Sterling:

Choke your coach, welcome back.
Assault a fan, welcome back.
Sexually assault someone and pay them off, welcome back.
Say something prejudicial in an illegally recorded conversation, banned for life.

What's crazy about today's society is that you can DO just about anything, apologize and pretend to be humbled and you're fine. SAY something that's not PC, especially if is recorded or in writing, and you will be DESTROYED.

Post by **dryfly** » Mon Jul 28 11:36 am

Bigbeer wrote:
Slap Shot wrote:Devil's Advocate thought on Donald Sterling:

Choke your coach, welcome back.
Assault a fan, welcome back.
Sexually assault someone and pay them off, welcome back.
Say something prejudicial in an illegally recorded conversation, banned for life.

What's crazy about today's society is that you can DO just about anything, apologize and pretend to be humbled and you're fine. SAY something that's not PC, especially if is recorded or in writing, and you will be DESTROYED.

We have always been a society that loves sinners who repent. Even if on death bed. Amazing Grace was written by one of the nation's worst slave traders turned repentant. Very late I might add - after amassing quite a fortune 'sinning'.

All Sterling needed to do was throw himself on his knees - and genuinely repent - do a bunch of PR and he could have all but ran for governor. Key point is he better sell it as genuine by putting some real action / money where his mouth was.

If you doubt me look at George C Wallace early vs. late ... Early: baring schoolhouse doors to keep black children out during desegregation... Late: in wheelchair admitting he was wrong and genuinely sorry, hugged by little old black church ladies. And I lived in Alabama those years - it was real.

America loves repentant sinners - what they hate are hypocrites trying to dodge their sentence.

dxmnkd316 · Post by **dxmnkd316** » Sun Aug 03 3:14 pm

http://espn.go.com/nba/story/_/id/11303 ... ere-wanted

Interesting. Also, I didn't know he was from Ontario. Maybe he won't be such a sally when it comes to the winters!

Also Pt. 2: THe Press is reporting that a trade is "likely" on August 23rd/24th.

Post by **Handyman** » Sun Aug 03 8:19 pm

If the Wolves pull off that deal they deserve nothing but good press no matter how bad the season goes. That kind of value for a dude they were losing in the offseason anyways is outstanding.

Post by **team22tank** » Sun Aug 03 8:30 pm

Handyman wrote:
team22tank wrote:
Handyman wrote:Why would they be happy he went public? He put them in a weaker trade position cause everyone knows he wants out.

Meaning generally speaking that he has told them he wants out vs. playing well into next season with the Wolves thinking they could have a chance to resign him.

As far as a weaker trade position I don't know about that. Sure maybe. However, now there is an open bidding war for him so if a team wants him they are going to have to pony up. Sure as hell better to get it out now than say closer to the trade deadline.

Is Tom Vanek in the same boat? Or is he better because he said, "I'm going to free agency." vs "trade me." Heck both guys put up awesome offensive numbers and play questionable D, couldn't be a more similar situation (in terms of the end result) other than K Love was more blunt.

Either way to make it sound like K. Love is the problem is ridiculous (and is a homer take), part of the problem? Sure I can go with that. Bottom line is the Wolves are very dysfunctional. They couldn't even get someone who wants to coach here.

You are kidding right? Why would teams give up anything for Love now knowing he will be a free agent after a year? He basically bent the Wolves over a barrel. There is no bidding war just like there wasnt for Santana when the entire MLB knew the Twins werent gonna sign him.

There are only so many teams that can even pretend to be in the KLove sweepstakes and half of them dont need him yet so they can wait. The teams that would overpay wont do it because they have no guarantee he wont leave after the season.

I have no ill will towards Love, I have liked him since college but the second he made it clear he wasnt coming back the Wolves were screwed...

So your tune has changed since June 28th?

Doesn't seem like such a bad thing that Love told the Wolves he was testing free agency after this season? Or do you still think he is bending them over the barrel?

Post by **Beauner** » Sun Aug 03 9:01 pm

team22tank wrote:
Handyman wrote:
team22tank wrote:
Handyman wrote:Why would they be happy he went public? He put them in a weaker trade position cause everyone knows he wants out.

Meaning generally speaking that he has told them he wants out vs. playing well into next season with the Wolves thinking they could have a chance to resign him.

As far as a weaker trade position I don't know about that. Sure maybe. However, now there is an open bidding war for him so if a team wants him they are going to have to pony up. Sure as hell better to get it out now than say closer to the trade deadline.

Is Tom Vanek in the same boat? Or is he better because he said, "I'm going to free agency." vs "trade me." Heck both guys put up awesome offensive numbers and play questionable D, couldn't be a more similar situation (in terms of the end result) other than K Love was more blunt.

Either way to make it sound like K. Love is the problem is ridiculous (and is a homer take), part of the problem? Sure I can go with that. Bottom line is the Wolves are very dysfunctional. They couldn't even get someone who wants to coach here.

You are kidding right? Why would teams give up anything for Love now knowing he will be a free agent after a year? He basically bent the Wolves over a barrel. There is no bidding war just like there wasnt for Santana when the entire MLB knew the Twins werent gonna sign him.

There are only so many teams that can even pretend to be in the KLove sweepstakes and half of them dont need him yet so they can wait. The teams that would overpay wont do it because they have no guarantee he wont leave after the season.

I have no ill will towards Love, I have liked him since college but the second he made it clear he wasnt coming back the Wolves were screwed...

So your tune has changed since June 28th?

Doesn't seem like such a bad thing that Love told the Wolves he was testing free agency after this season? Or do you still think he is bending them over the barrel?

The tune changed when LeBron signed with Cleveland. They have requisite value to make deal for KLove and the pressure to do it to satisfy LeBron because he's on a 2 year deal.

Post by **team22tank** » Sun Aug 03 9:04 pm

Oh. Mine has always been the same, better to know if a player wants out and he is open and honest to the organization so the team can then do what they thinks is best at that point.

And that appears what the Wolves are doing. Not a bad scenario at all.

Post by **Beauner** » Sun Aug 03 9:07 pm

team22tank wrote:Oh. Mine has always been the same, better to know if a player wants out and he is open and honest to the organization so the team can then do what they thinks is best at that point.

I have no problem with letting the team know ahead of time that he has no plans to sign with them, I just don't like that he did it so publicly. Lowered his value quite a bit when everybody in the NBA knew he had no intention of returning to MN.

Post by **team22tank** » Sun Aug 03 9:13 pm

Beauner wrote:
team22tank wrote:Oh. Mine has always been the same, better to know if a player wants out and he is open and honest to the organization so the team can then do what they thinks is best at that point.

I have no problem with letting the team know ahead of time that he has no plans to sign with them, I just don't like that he did it so publicly. Lowered his value quite a bit when everybody in the NBA knew he had no intention of returning to MN.

Do you have an example of how he or his agent went public, just curious because I must have missed it. From what I heard it is that he told the Wolves he plans to test free agency after this season (he technically didn't even asked to be traded but of course I understand it is the same thing). This was then reported by insiders. So if he or agent ever went public I would be interested in seeing it.

Post by **Shooter** » Sun Aug 03 9:31 pm

He went on sports nation espn shortly after the rumors and referred to the wolves as "they" and spoke in the past tense about his connection to the club. There was no we or us, he made it clear. It will be interesting to see what kind of player he is in cleveland with better teammates. He seems like a get mine stat guy, but maybe that was a product of the lack of talent on the moon howlers. I never watched him play for team USA.

Post by **Handyman** » Sun Aug 03 10:24 pm

Beauner wrote:
team22tank wrote:Oh. Mine has always been the same, better to know if a player wants out and he is open and honest to the organization so the team can then do what they thinks is best at that point.

I have no problem with letting the team know ahead of time that he has no plans to sign with them, I just don't like that he did it so publicly. Lowered his value quite a bit when everybody in the NBA knew he had no intention of returning to MN.

Bingo!

Post by **Handyman** » Sun Aug 03 10:24 pm

Shooter wrote:He went on sports nation espn shortly after the rumors and referred to the wolves as "they" and spoke in the past tense about his connection to the club. There was no we or us, he made it clear. It will be interesting to see what kind of player he is in cleveland with better teammates. He seems like a get mine stat guy, but maybe that was a product of the lack of talent on the moon howlers. I never watched him play for team USA.

Your facts are not welcome here good sir!! :lol:

Post by **team22tank** » Sun Aug 03 10:33 pm

Handyman wrote:
Shooter wrote:He went on sports nation espn shortly after the rumors and referred to the wolves as "they" and spoke in the past tense about his connection to the club. There was no we or us, he made it clear. It will be interesting to see what kind of player he is in cleveland with better teammates. He seems like a get mine stat guy, but maybe that was a product of the lack of talent on the moon howlers. I never watched him play for team USA.

Your facts are not welcome here good sir!!

http://www.sbnation.com/2014/6/3/5775644/kevin-love-trade-rumors-demand-minnesota-timberwolves :biggrin2:

Thus, if Love truly wants out -- and all indications say that he does and that he's informed the Timberwolves in advance that he won't re-sign after next year -- it does him no good to speak up. Either he risks a fine or he says something he doesn't mean that can be used against him later. The best way to handle the situation is to inform the Timberwolves of his plans not to re-sign privately and then let the process play out. That's what he's doing, even if a weekend vacation to the same city as one of the many Love Affair suitors raises eyebrows.

Post by **monty** » Mon Aug 04 8:32 am

I think the new coach of Cleveland has more to do with wanting Love than James does. Love is a 'stretch" #4 and the new coach's system uses that position the most.

dxmnkd316 · Post by **dxmnkd316** » Thu Aug 07 8:49 am

Sounds like the trade has been agreed upon for Kevin Love. He's committed to staying in Cleveland and resigning in 2015.

Sounds like we get Wiggins, Bennett, and the 2015 1st round protected pick. Quite the haul.

Post by **mjarz02** » Thu Aug 07 9:55 am

dxmnkd316 wrote:Sounds like the trade has been agreed upon for Kevin Love. He's committed to staying in Cleveland and resigning in 2015.

Sounds like we get Wiggins, Bennett, and the 2015 1st round protected pick. Quite the haul.

I would like to keep Bennett, even though he could be a bust. Seems like they are trying to trade him and get Thaddeus Young. Hopefully get rid Martin's contract or at the very least JJ.

I thought Thaddeus Young was much older but he's only 26.

Post by **trixR4kids** » Thu Aug 07 10:05 am

Lol, Gilbert is such a horrible owner.

Post by **Armadillo** » Thu Aug 07 10:36 am

trixR4kids wrote:Lol, Gilbert is such a horrible owner.

The Cavs are trying to win NOW. No need for draft picks or unproven young talent. I don't know that I can call an owner who has LeBron James, Kevin Love, and Kyrie Irving on his team "horrible."

I will say, getting the top draft pick 3 out of 4 years is an unreal stretch of luck.

Post by **trixR4kids** » Thu Aug 07 10:46 am

Wiggins is unproven but at worst he'll be a solid defender and at best he can be a complimentary player to Lebron. If they want to trade him they can do it midseason, there's no rush.

And yeah, he did such a great job to acquire Lebron and get good draft picks :lol:

Either way the T-wolves will benefit from his incompetency.

Post by **Thirty-Four** » Thu Aug 07 10:52 am

Gilbert will find a way to f*ck this up.

One injury to the Big Three (most likely Love) and they aren't winning a title. Lebron is on a year to year contract, and I'd trust Love about as far as Marbury. :lol:

Post by **trixR4kids** » Thu Aug 07 10:53 am

Lebron will stay there, he's not dumb enough to leave a 2nd time.

Post by **mjarz02** » Thu Aug 07 10:56 am

With how Blatt runs his offense he needs a player like love. Cleveland also lacks outside shooting. With Lebron and Kyrie able to create their own shot, Love is going to get some good looks. If they can add a defensive player like Marion, this team will be hard to stop.

I think both teams benefit. Love was going to leave and we need pieces to rebuild.

Post by **trixR4kids** » Thu Aug 07 11:04 am

I agree that both teams benefit, even if they do it now. But Gilbert has far more leverage and could probably work out a more favorable deal closer to the deadline.

Post by **mjarz02** » Thu Aug 07 11:05 am

Thirty-Four wrote:Gilbert will find a way to f*ck this up.

One injury to the Big Three (most likely Love) and they aren't winning a title. Lebron is on a year to year contract, and I'd trust Love about as far as Marbury.

I really don't see Lebron leaving. He was tired of being the Villain. Now he's the hero and in two years will be able to sign a larger contract.

Love has had his problems defensively. I think the biggest part about playing defense is effort. Lebron will ensure the effort will be there and Love should improve on this end.

Post by **gopherguy13** » Thu Aug 07 11:07 am

So explain the max contract thing to me.

They said on the Power Trip that Love would be getting a max deal in Cleveland? I thought you could only have one max deal per team, why would LeBron not be getting it?

Post by **team22tank** » Thu Aug 07 11:10 am

trixR4kids wrote:I agree that both teams benefit, even if they do it now. But Gilbert has far more leverage and could probably work out a more favorable deal closer to the deadline.

That could be true but what if the Wolves dealt Love to the next best option before season start? I think Cleveland wants to get the party started day 1.

Post by **trixR4kids** » Thu Aug 07 11:13 am

They've already talked with the Warriors and they didn't want to give up as much as the Wolves asked. The other teams don't have much to offer (the Bulls). There really is no reason to rush it.

Post by **team22tank** » Thu Aug 07 11:18 am

trixR4kids wrote:They've already talked with the Warriors and they didn't want to give up as much as the Wolves asked. The other teams don't have much to offer (the Bulls). There really is no reason to rush it.

So you are saying Cleveland should hang on to Wiggins for a portion of the year to see if his upside is so great now that it makes sense to keep him? What if either player gets hurt?

The Wolves aren't starting the season with Love if the Cleveland deal didn't work out they would move forward with something else.

dxmnkd316 · Post by **dxmnkd316** » Thu Aug 07 11:22 am

gopherguy13 wrote:So explain the max contract thing to me.

They said on the Power Trip that Love would be getting a max deal in Cleveland? I thought you could only have one max deal per team, why would LeBron not be getting it?

I think you're allowed multiple max contracts but that refers to the dollar/year. I think each team is only allowed one five-year contract. If I'm remembering the Love/Rubio drama from a few years back.

Post by **mjarz02** » Thu Aug 07 11:23 am

trixR4kids wrote:They've already talked with the Warriors and they didn't want to give up as much as the Wolves asked. The other teams don't have much to offer (the Bulls). There really is no reason to rush it.

But if Lebron wants Love on the squad and so does Blatt, what's the advantage of waiting? These players need time to gel. If you wait and Wiggins plays bad, then the wolves could ask for more.

Post by **team22tank** » Thu Aug 07 11:26 am

mjarz02 wrote:
trixR4kids wrote:They've already talked with the Warriors and they didn't want to give up as much as the Wolves asked. The other teams don't have much to offer (the Bulls). There really is no reason to rush it.

But if Lebron wants Love on the squad and so does Blatt, what's the advantage of waiting? These players need time to gel. If you wait and Wiggins plays bad, then the wolves could ask for more.

There isn't any reason to wait if this is the what they want. Waiting would only allow factors to come into the picture that would mess it up.

This is Lebron's league, his team, getting Love a player that is younger than Lebron is a no-brainier. No one in Cleveland, fan or owner gives a rip about the future after Lebron.

dxmnkd316 · Post by **dxmnkd316** » Thu Aug 07 11:29 am

The thing I think is hilarious in all this is that the team that has gotten absolute assf*ked in the lottery will now have three straight #1 overalls on their team.

Post by **trixR4kids** » Thu Aug 07 11:36 am

If Wiggins gets hurt it depends on the injury but even then he still has many years ahead of him. If Love gets hurt then Cleveland dodged a bullet.

I suppose you could argue that there's a risk of someone else getting Love but not many of those other teams have much to offer. CHI would likely give up someone not named Noah or Rose (Heinrich or something), GS doesn't seem interested in giving up Klay Thompson and it looks like that ship has long sailed. I guess MN could just try and shop him desperately before the season but that'd be dumb. There's also the possibility that Love would be a free agent and the Cavs could have him AND Wiggins if they don't trade for him right away.

But if Lebron wants Love on the squad and so does Blatt, what's the advantage of waiting? These players need time to gel. If you wait and Wiggins plays bad, then the wolves could ask for more.

Wiggins isn't likely to be an absolute bust though that's the thing. I feel like people think Wiggins has equal potential to be a bust or a great player even though it's far less likely that he'd be a bust. Also IDK when the deadline is but they'd likely have enough time to gel.

Post by **Bonin21** » Thu Aug 07 11:38 am

dxmnkd316 wrote:The thing I think is hilarious in all this is that the team that has gotten absolute assf*ked in the lottery will now have three straight #1 overalls on their team.

I don't get it?

Post by **team22tank** » Thu Aug 07 11:42 am

If the Cavs waited until or around the deadline to get Love they would be dealing with a different team than the Wolves.

Post by **trixR4kids** » Thu Aug 07 11:47 am

If the Wolves wanted to trade him elsewhere they could've done it before the draft and got a ton of picks, but they didn't. Sorry but no other deal is gonna trump the one already on the table here. The other teams that want to "win now" don't have any assets worth trading to MN.

Post by **team22tank** » Thu Aug 07 11:50 am

trixR4kids wrote:If the Wolves wanted to trade him elsewhere they could've done it before the draft and got a ton of picks, but they didn't. Sorry but no other deal is gonna trump the one already on the table here. The other teams that want to "win now" don't have any assets worth trading to MN.

You are right no other deal is going to trump this one. However, if the Cavs were to pull it off the table there would be a next best deal and the Wolves would move forward. Kevin Love is toxic to the Wolves now, if the Cavs deal were pulled the Wolves wouldn't choose to start the season with him.

dxmnkd316 · Post by **dxmnkd316** » Thu Aug 07 11:50 am

Bonin21 wrote:
dxmnkd316 wrote:The thing I think is hilarious in all this is that the team that has gotten absolute assf*ked in the lottery will now have three straight #1 overalls on their team.

I don't get it?

The Wolves have never really moved up in the lottery. Now they will have Wiggins, Bennett, and the ... wait... $h!t. Ok, the last two #1 picks and Cleveland's 2015 first rounder :lol:

Post by **trixR4kids** » Thu Aug 07 12:14 pm

team22tank wrote:
trixR4kids wrote:If the Wolves wanted to trade him elsewhere they could've done it before the draft and got a ton of picks, but they didn't. Sorry but no other deal is gonna trump the one already on the table here. The other teams that want to "win now" don't have any assets worth trading to MN.

You are right no other deal is going to trump this one. However, if the Cavs were to pull it off the table there would be a next best deal and the Wolves would move forward. Kevin Love is toxic to the Wolves now, if the Cavs deal were pulled the Wolves wouldn't choose to start the season with him.

And they'd get something far worse. At which point you could start looking for a new GM. I feel like if there was no chance of him playing for the Wolves this year they would've traded him before the draft.

Post by **Alby22** » Thu Aug 07 12:31 pm

[quote="trixR4kids"]If Wiggins gets hurt it depends on the injury but even then he still has many years ahead of him. If Love gets hurt then Cleveland dodged a bullet.

There's also the possibility that Love would be a free agent and the Cavs could have him AND Wiggins if they don't trade for him right away.

The Cavs wouldn't have the cap room to sign Love as a free agent. They need to trade for him

Post by **Golden FE Ranger** » Thu Aug 07 12:33 pm

trixR4kids wrote:If Wiggins gets hurt it depends on the injury but even then he still has many years ahead of him. If Love gets hurt then Cleveland dodged a bullet.

I suppose you could argue that there's a risk of someone else getting Love but not many of those other teams have much to offer. CHI would likely give up someone not named Noah or Rose (Heinrich or something), GS doesn't seem interested in giving up Klay Thompson and it looks like that ship has long sailed. I guess MN could just try and shop him desperately before the season but that'd be dumb. There's also the possibility that Love would be a free agent and the Cavs could have him AND Wiggins if they don't trade for him right away.

I have to guess that this all comes down to what LeBron wants and when he wanted it. As far as free agency goes, I would imagine they think that although Love might be happy to go to Cle, it might not be his first choice. As a free agent, a team like the Lakers might be higher on the list.

Post by **trixR4kids** » Thu Aug 07 12:39 pm

Alby22 wrote:
The Cavs wouldn't have the cap room to sign Love as a free agent. They need to trade for him

Isn't he going to get a max deal either way?

Post by **team22tank** » Thu Aug 07 12:44 pm

trixR4kids wrote:
Alby22 wrote:
The Cavs wouldn't have the cap room to sign Love as a free agent. They need to trade for him

Isn't he going to get a max deal either way?

Assuming they still have Wiggins and whoever would be in on the trade there is no way to swing Love via FA.

Post by **Beauner** » Thu Aug 07 1:20 pm

team22tank wrote:
trixR4kids wrote:They've already talked with the Warriors and they didn't want to give up as much as the Wolves asked. The other teams don't have much to offer (the Bulls). There really is no reason to rush it.

So you are saying Cleveland should hang on to Wiggins for a portion of the year to see if his upside is so great now that it makes sense to keep him? What if either player gets hurt?

The Wolves aren't starting the season with Love if the Cleveland deal didn't work out they would move forward with something else.

This.

Cleveland had no reason to wait. They are getting a top 10 player in the league for an unproven guy, a guy who looked like a mega-bust last year, and a mid-20s pick.

The Wolves are getting rid of a guy who didn't want to be here, and in return getting a guy who could end up being elite, a guy who looked like a mega-bust last year, and a mid-20s pick.

If nothing else, Wiggins brings excitement back to an organization that desperately needed it. If the Wolves are able to swing a deal for Thaddeus Young (possibly JJ Barea and a pick?) we could go into next season with a lineup of Rubio-Martin-Wiggins-Young-Pek and a bench of Lavine, Mo Williams, Anthony Bennett, Dieng, Brewer, Shabazz, and Budinger. That is a young team with a lot of depth and a ton of potential.

If Cleveland holds on to Wiggins as Trix is saying, and he is clearly overmatched or gets hurt then the Wolves have other options. Even if GSW doesn't throw in Klay. Chicago was offering a decent package and has a guy Flip was enamored with (Doug McBuckets) and a couple foreign guys who look to be studs. Boston has a ton of picks from a team that is going to be bad for a long time (the Nets) and loved KLove too.
Maybe the Lakers get involved or the Knicks? Then Cleveland's asking price is raised rather than lowered.

Really when it comes down to it, LeBron James is calling the shots in Cleveland and he wants another superstar on his team and wants one now. Which is why I said he'd sign with Cleveland and the Wolves would trade Love to Cleveland the day they won the lottery.

Post by **Beauner** » Thu Aug 07 1:31 pm

trixR4kids wrote:
Alby22 wrote:
The Cavs wouldn't have the cap room to sign Love as a free agent. They need to trade for him

Isn't he going to get a max deal either way?

You can go over the cap to sign guys on your roster--part of the new CBA agreement to help increase "player retention" so you see more guys like Larry Bird and Kobe who play for 1 team their whole career. Can't go over the cap to sign FA.
Since Love has 1 year left on his deal + an option, they'll be able to trade for his current contract and then sign him to a mega-deal regardless of figure (I hate the term Max Contract since Kyrie Irving just signed a "max contract" too). If Love was able to hit FA, he'd have a maximum of 4 years on the deal (5 years if re-signing with your current team, 4 if signing as a FA) and I forget what the max amount for an incoming FA is, but the re-sign bonus is something like 125% or 150% of the FA max.

All that to say--the NBA's salary cap rules are :censored:

ing confusing and pretty stupid.

Post by **Viking** » Thu Aug 07 1:54 pm

Beauner wrote:
trixR4kids wrote:
Alby22 wrote:
The Cavs wouldn't have the cap room to sign Love as a free agent. They need to trade for him

Isn't he going to get a max deal either way?

You can go over the cap to sign guys on your roster--part of the new CBA agreement to help increase "player retention" so you see more guys like Larry Bird and Kobe who play for 1 team their whole career. Can't go over the cap to sign FA.
Since Love has 1 year left on his deal + an option, they'll be able to trade for his current contract and then sign him to a mega-deal regardless of figure (I hate the term Max Contract since Kyrie Irving just signed a "max contract" too). If Love was able to hit FA, he'd have a maximum of 4 years on the deal (5 years if re-signing with your current team, 4 if signing as a FA) and I forget what the max amount for an incoming FA is, but the re-sign bonus is something like 125% or 150% of the FA max.

All that to say--the NBA's salary cap rules are ing confusing and pretty stupid.

I don't think that's a new part of the CBA. It's been called the Larry Bird rule for a long time.

Post by **Shooter** » Thu Aug 07 2:21 pm

Viking wrote:
Beauner wrote:
trixR4kids wrote:
Alby22 wrote:
The Cavs wouldn't have the cap room to sign Love as a free agent. They need to trade for him

Isn't he going to get a max deal either way?

You can go over the cap to sign guys on your roster--part of the new CBA agreement to help increase "player retention" so you see more guys like Larry Bird and Kobe who play for 1 team their whole career. Can't go over the cap to sign FA.
Since Love has 1 year left on his deal + an option, they'll be able to trade for his current contract and then sign him to a mega-deal regardless of figure (I hate the term Max Contract since Kyrie Irving just signed a "max contract" too). If Love was able to hit FA, he'd have a maximum of 4 years on the deal (5 years if re-signing with your current team, 4 if signing as a FA) and I forget what the max amount for an incoming FA is, but the re-sign bonus is something like 125% or 150% of the FA max.

All that to say--the NBA's salary cap rules are ing confusing and pretty stupid.

I don't think that's a new part of the CBA. It's been called the Larry Bird rule for a long time.

Stick to baseball Trix :wink:

Post by **trixR4kids** » Thu Aug 07 2:22 pm

There's a reason I asked the question, don't know much about the BBall CBA :wink:

If anything you should be calling me out for my arguments which come from Grantland

Post by **mjarz02** » Thu Aug 07 5:10 pm

Shooter wrote:
Viking wrote:
Beauner wrote:
trixR4kids wrote:
Alby22 wrote:
The Cavs wouldn't have the cap room to sign Love as a free agent. They need to trade for him

Isn't he going to get a max deal either way?

You can go over the cap to sign guys on your roster--part of the new CBA agreement to help increase "player retention" so you see more guys like Larry Bird and Kobe who play for 1 team their whole career. Can't go over the cap to sign FA.
Since Love has 1 year left on his deal + an option, they'll be able to trade for his current contract and then sign him to a mega-deal regardless of figure (I hate the term Max Contract since Kyrie Irving just signed a "max contract" too). If Love was able to hit FA, he'd have a maximum of 4 years on the deal (5 years if re-signing with your current team, 4 if signing as a FA) and I forget what the max amount for an incoming FA is, but the re-sign bonus is something like 125% or 150% of the FA max.

All that to say--the NBA's salary cap rules are ing confusing and pretty stupid.

I don't think that's a new part of the CBA. It's been called the Larry Bird rule for a long time.

Stick to baseball Trix

I believe the new cba allowed players that were traded to transfer their bird rights to the new team.

Post by **team22tank** » Fri Aug 08 9:48 am

bhahahaha

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3svPkthjWcM[/youtube]

"maybe he'll come back, like Lebron!"

Watch all the way through the end, Tommy G makes an appearance!

Post by **Dances With Gophers** » Sun Aug 10 2:50 pm

Self: Wiggins wants to join Wolves

dxmnkd316 · Post by **dxmnkd316** » Sun Aug 10 2:54 pm

Why is that so preposterous?

Think about this: on the Cavs he's the fourth star on the roster after James, Love, Irving.

Here? The fans want him, he'd be first billing.

Post by **Dances With Gophers** » Sun Aug 10 3:51 pm

dxmnkd316 wrote:Why is that so preposterous?

Think about this: on the Cavs he's the fourth star on the roster after James, Love, Irving.

Here? The fans want him, he'd be first billing.

That's certainly one way of looking at things, Pollyanna. :lol:

Why on earth would anyone want to win championships with James, Love, and Irving when they could be "first billing" on a franchise that reeks of fail? :confused2:

Note: the assertion in my post would almost certainly be 'liked' by Zach LaVine and other NBA'ers

Post by **Handyman** » Sun Aug 10 8:27 pm

Why would he want to play for a team that doesnt want him?

Post by **Dances With Gophers** » Sun Aug 10 11:13 pm

Doesn't want is different from willing to trade.
Did the Twins "not want" Frankie Viola? Did the Cowboys "not want" Herschel Walker? No - they chose instead to roll the dice on a deal. Don't tell me that if the Cavs could afford Wiggins that they wouldn't keep him in a nano-second.
Also, the Tpups suck something fierce.

Post by **Handyman** » Mon Aug 11 7:26 am

Dances With Gophers wrote:Doesn't want is different from willing to trade.
Did the Twins "not want" Frankie Viola? Did the Cowboys "not want" Herschel Walker? No - they chose instead to roll the dice on a deal. Don't tell me that if the Cavs could afford Wiggins that they wouldn't keep him in a nano-second.
Also, the Tpups suck something fierce.

They dont want him because Lebron doesnt. This is pretty common knowledge. (I dont care a lick for the NBA and I know this) But dont let that get in the way of your little rant about the Wolves.

Post by **Chris83** » Fri Aug 22 11:15 am

According to various sources:

Minnesota Gets:
Andrew Wiggins from Cleveland
Anthony Bennett from Cleveland
Thaddeus Young from Philadelphia
$4 million trade exception

Cleveland Gets:
Kevin Love from Minnesota

Philadelphia Gets:
Cavs 2015 first round pick (from Miami)
Expiring contracts of Luc Richard Mbah A Moute and Alexey Shved from Wolves

Post by **davescharf** » Fri Aug 22 11:49 am

Chris83 wrote:According to various sources:

Minnesota Gets:
Andrew Wiggins from Cleveland
Anthony Bennett from Cleveland
Thaddeus Young from Philadelphia
$4 million trade exception

Cleveland Gets:
Kevin Love from Minnesota

Philadelphia Gets:
Cavs 2015 first round pick (from Miami)
Expiring contracts of Luc Richard Mbah A Moute and Alexey Shved from Wolves

I'm not a great NBA mind but that seems like a really good haul for a guy we'd be losing after the season. The only bad thing I can think of is if the Meerkat's refusal to give Love the 5th year comes up roses for the Wolves because then people will forget what an utter idiot he is when it comes ot being a GM.

dxmnkd316 · Post by **dxmnkd316** » Fri Aug 22 3:22 pm

Apparently the Suns have reached out to the Wolves trying to get Love in a trade for Eric Bledsoe.

lolwut?

Post by **ScoobyDoo** » Fri Aug 22 3:31 pm

dxmnkd316 wrote:Apparently the Suns have reached out to the Wolves trying to get Love in a trade for Eric Bledsoe.

lolwut?

That's way better than the Cleveland/Philly deal. :dance:

Post by **Beauner** » Fri Aug 22 6:21 pm

ScoobyDoo wrote:
dxmnkd316 wrote:Apparently the Suns have reached out to the Wolves trying to get Love in a trade for Eric Bledsoe.

lolwut?

That's way better than the Cleveland/Philly deal.

Phoenix was a rumored suitor at the beginning of the trade rumors. The Wolves reportedly love Bledsoe and he'd be the centerpiece of the package, and they could potentially have given us Goran Dragic and a couple picks or other players. But at this point, I'm not sure why this is even brought up. The Wolves aren't going to back out of the deal with Cleveland, especially if they are getting Thaddeus Young without giving up Bennett.

Post by **mjarz02** » Fri Aug 22 6:30 pm

ScoobyDoo wrote:
dxmnkd316 wrote:Apparently the Suns have reached out to the Wolves trying to get Love in a trade for Eric Bledsoe.

lolwut?

That's way better than the Cleveland/Philly deal.

With Phoenix drafting Ennis, signing Isaiah Thomas and having Dragic, Bledsoe seems to be expendable. I would rather have wiggins but if there was some way to get Bledsoe on this team our future would be really bright. Rubio, some draft picks, and get another team involved because Phoenix won't need Rubio. Not likely, but it would be awesome.

Post by **MATT** » Sat Aug 23 4:56 am

Yesssssss, mooaar!
V. Stiviano Explains: She Was Merely Donald Sterling's 'Beard Mistress'