Twins 2012 season

[Bushwood Gopher]

Twins just got jobbed in the bottom of the 7th with the game tied and runners in scoring position.

They didn't at all. It was an impossible call to make and in my view they made the right one. If he trapped it there's no way he gets it off the grass as fast as he did from that angle.

Good to see the 4 hopper is back from left field!!! Bremer's call as Moustakos was rounding 3rd: "And Revere's arm...." with the 'r' and 'm' of the word trailing off after about the 3rd hop or so. I gotta tell ya, I find a lot of entertainment in these games still.

[Beauner]

Twins just got jobbed in the bottom of the 7th with the game tied and runners in scoring position.

They didn't at all. It was an impossible call to make and in my view they made the right one. If he trapped it there's no way he gets it off the grass as fast as he did from that angle.

Good to see the 4 hopper is back from left field!!! Bremer's call as Moustakos was rounding 3rd: "And Revere's arm...." with the 'r' and 'm' of the word trailing off after about the 3rd hop or so. I gotta tell ya, I find a lot of entertainment in these games still.

I think that was the right call. It looked on the first catch like he trapped it but when they showed the other angle it looked like it went right to the leather. If he did trap it, kudos to him for picking it up so quickly and smoothly and getting it back in. I think he caught it though.

Damn it Bushwood, as soon as I signed in and saw that you had posted I knew you beat me to the Revere arm.
My buddy and I broke it down (rewinding it probably 10 times). We're guessing he threw the ball from approximately 150 feet with a full head of steam. He landed the ball 4-6 feet onto the infield grass, 15 feet up the line. It 3-hopped the catcher, who was 10 feet in front of the base line. From our rough estimation, that was a 140 foot, 3-hop throw.
Embarrassing.

[Bushwood Gopher]

Twins just got jobbed in the bottom of the 7th with the game tied and runners in scoring position.

They didn't at all. It was an impossible call to make and in my view they made the right one. If he trapped it there's no way he gets it off the grass as fast as he did from that angle.

Good to see the 4 hopper is back from left field!!! Bremer's call as Moustakos was rounding 3rd: "And Revere's arm...." with the 'r' and 'm' of the word trailing off after about the 3rd hop or so. I gotta tell ya, I find a lot of entertainment in these games still.

I think that was the right call. It looked on the first catch like he trapped it but when they showed the other angle it looked like it went right to the leather. If he did trap it, kudos to him for picking it up so quickly and smoothly and getting it back in. I think he caught it though.

Damn it Bushwood, as soon as I signed in and saw that you had posted I knew you beat me to the Revere arm.
My buddy and I broke it down (rewinding it probably 10 times). We're guessing he threw the ball from approximately 150 feet with a full head of steam. He landed the ball 4-6 feet onto the infield grass, 15 feet up the line. It 3-hopped the catcher, who was 10 feet in front of the base line. From our rough estimation, that was a 140 foot, 3-hop throw.
Embarrassing.

That is a mighty impressive (and comical) breakdown Beauner! Nice work.

I've never seen anything like it at this level. Most high school outfielders can throw better than that from where he was.

[Beauner]

Twins just got jobbed in the bottom of the 7th with the game tied and runners in scoring position.

They didn't at all. It was an impossible call to make and in my view they made the right one. If he trapped it there's no way he gets it off the grass as fast as he did from that angle.

Good to see the 4 hopper is back from left field!!! Bremer's call as Moustakos was rounding 3rd: "And Revere's arm...." with the 'r' and 'm' of the word trailing off after about the 3rd hop or so. I gotta tell ya, I find a lot of entertainment in these games still.

I think that was the right call. It looked on the first catch like he trapped it but when they showed the other angle it looked like it went right to the leather. If he did trap it, kudos to him for picking it up so quickly and smoothly and getting it back in. I think he caught it though.

Damn it Bushwood, as soon as I signed in and saw that you had posted I knew you beat me to the Revere arm.
My buddy and I broke it down (rewinding it probably 10 times). We're guessing he threw the ball from approximately 150 feet with a full head of steam. He landed the ball 4-6 feet onto the infield grass, 15 feet up the line. It 3-hopped the catcher, who was 10 feet in front of the base line. From our rough estimation, that was a 140 foot, 3-hop throw.
Embarrassing.

That is a mighty impressive (and comical) breakdown Beauner! Nice work.

I've never seen anything like it at this level. Most high school outfielders can throw better than that from where he was.

I'd bet 10 of my 12 players (14 year olds) for this summer can throw better than that from where he was.

[Superstar]

Man that ump tonight had someplace to be...some of those strikes were WAY outside.

[Six Hole]

I'll concede that Revere has above-average range in the outfield, but given his arm issues, the Twins should -- and this should have started last year -- have him taking ground balls instead of attempting to improve arm strength by throwing a football. I'd love him as a second baseman. At the very least, he could run the ball over to the first baseman if he still had issues with the distance.

[JWG]

This may be the worst Twins team in history...

[dryfly]

:(

This may be the worst Twins team in history...

Hey - just remember 'the seasons not over'... probably meaning we got lots more of this before October [when we can switch it up and start saying 'the seasons not over' for the Vikings].

[Bushwood Gopher]

I'll concede that Revere has above-average range in the outfield, but given his arm issues, the Twins should -- and this should have started last year -- have him taking ground balls instead of attempting to improve arm strength by throwing a football. I'd love him as a second baseman. At the very least, he could run the ball over to the first baseman if he still had issues with the distance.

Not an outrageous suggestion. He would have value as a 2B, and even if he's never fielded an infield ground ball in his life he would start out no worse than Nishioka. Of course, I'm sure somebody can make the case that his 40, cone drill and shuttle run times are actually worth 12.7 wins a year as an outfielder.

[Handyman]

I have been saying he should play second since pretty much his first attempt to throw home. I am sure there is some stat that will show he actually has an amazing arm though so it is all good

He is not a big league center fielder...he isnt even an International League center fielder.

[Dolphin275]

:(

This may be the worst Twins team in history...

Hey, were on track to win 40 games this year
Could be worse.
Imagine being an Angels fan, they have twice the payroll, and only one more win

[Six Hole]

Imagine being an Angels fan, they have twice the payroll, and only one more win

Or imagine being a Royals fan. 2/3 the payroll but five times the potential.

[bearpaw28]

Lol. Ok. Abandon your original argument of "Mauer doesn't produce with RISP". I think I made a rather strong case that Mauer's offensive production INCREASES with RISP. Feel free to actually rebut it.

My favorite part of this post was how you make an argument then contradict it by wondering how much is gardenhire's fault.

Who said he doesn't produce with RISP? We were arguing that he doesn't change his approach based on the situation, and doesn't change his approach to drive in runs late in the game. He's a good hitter. He gets hits when there's nobody on, he gets hits when somebody is on. Obviously the guy gets hits with RISP or he'd never drive anybody in because he doesn't hit the ball over the fence on a consistent basis. Singles with runners on 2B don't always score runs.

His average in "high leverage" (late and close) situations is 35 points lower than his career average (.288). His OPS is lower. His OBP is lower. He has lower slugging%.
Those are things we are talking about.


Your little Sabermetric stats look great on paper, but if you've ever watched him late in the game with one specific job to do (get the runner in) he doesn't change his approach to do it. He goes up there with the "I want to get on base!" approach. That's what we're arguing. It's a great approach for a table-setter. He's batting in a run-producing slot.

AMEN. Wow do you get it.

This was the point of my posts too...Beauner described it better and in more detail. BOTTOM LINE - A hitter of JoMo's capability should be able to adjust his approach to drive in runs in key situations...period.

But JoMo is the least of the Twins problems...what a joke of a pitching staff...and with all due respect to Terry Ryan...the Pohlad's dumped Billy Smith because he wanted to spent TOO MUCH OF THEIR MONEY IN 2012.

How's that working for them?

[Greyeagle]

I have been saying he should play second since pretty much his first attempt to throw home. I am sure there is some stat that will show he actually has an amazing arm though so it is all good

He can run the ball in faster from the outfield.....but I am holding out for a graph to show me this.

[sec 16 row16 seat 16 17]

Billy butler is a twinkies killer.

[streakygopher]

The compartmentalizing and picking out certain phrases from people's posts to make your own point about a cerain hitter is what is funny to me.

It seems pretty simple to me. If you are ok with a no. 3 hitter being an on-base, hit for average guy, and the Twins paying big bucks for that, then Mauer is "your guy". If you think that the Twins should be getting more power and runs driven in from the no. 3 spot considering the dollars invested, then Mauer really isn't "the guy" for you. And this isn't just a critism based on what is happening this year as it has been this way for quite awhile. I guess agreeing to disagree on the issue is the best route to take at this point since neither side is going to change the other's viewpoint.

I don't disagree at all. The 3-spot needs more. However, this is a Twins' management problem, not a Mauer problem. Mauer is the guy they went after and hasn't changed, maybe can't change. People said the same thing about Hrbek...why can't a first baseman who's 6'4', 240 pounds (I'm being kind ) hit 30+ homers every year? Well, Hrbek was never that kind of hitter. He hit over 30 homers once in his career. Yes, he could hit for power and sometimes did. But he also hit well to the opposite field when he was behind in the count, because he was a pretty solid contact hitter. I think if you ask a guy like that to pull the ball it may come at the expense of lowering his average and on-base percentage...and for what, 4 or 5 more homers a year? Is it worth it? I'll leave it to the statistics wonks to answer that one.

[Greyeagle]

Twins won't lose today!

[Bushwood Gopher]

The compartmentalizing and picking out certain phrases from people's posts to make your own point about a cerain hitter is what is funny to me.

It seems pretty simple to me. If you are ok with a no. 3 hitter being an on-base, hit for average guy, and the Twins paying big bucks for that, then Mauer is "your guy". If you think that the Twins should be getting more power and runs driven in from the no. 3 spot considering the dollars invested, then Mauer really isn't "the guy" for you. And this isn't just a critism based on what is happening this year as it has been this way for quite awhile. I guess agreeing to disagree on the issue is the best route to take at this point since neither side is going to change the other's viewpoint.

I don't disagree at all. The 3-spot needs more. However, this is a Twins' management problem, not a Mauer problem. Mauer is the guy they went after and hasn't changed, maybe can't change. People said the same thing about Hrbek...why can't a first baseman who's 6'4', 240 pounds (I'm being kind ) hit 30+ homers every year? Well, Hrbek was never that kind of hitter. He hit over 30 homers once in his career. Yes, he could hit for power and sometimes did. But he also hit well to the opposite field when he was behind in the count, because he was a pretty solid contact hitter. I think if you ask a guy like that to pull the ball it may come at the expense of lowering his average and on-base percentage...and for what, 4 or 5 more homers a year? Is it worth it? I'll leave it to the statistics wonks to answer that one.

Kent Hrbek hit 20+ HRs in 10 of his 12 full seasons.

[monty]

:(

This may be the worst Twins team in history...

This is the worst starting pitching team in Twins history.

[streakygopher]

The compartmentalizing and picking out certain phrases from people's posts to make your own point about a cerain hitter is what is funny to me.

It seems pretty simple to me. If you are ok with a no. 3 hitter being an on-base, hit for average guy, and the Twins paying big bucks for that, then Mauer is "your guy". If you think that the Twins should be getting more power and runs driven in from the no. 3 spot considering the dollars invested, then Mauer really isn't "the guy" for you. And this isn't just a critism based on what is happening this year as it has been this way for quite awhile. I guess agreeing to disagree on the issue is the best route to take at this point since neither side is going to change the other's viewpoint.

I don't disagree at all. The 3-spot needs more. However, this is a Twins' management problem, not a Mauer problem. Mauer is the guy they went after and hasn't changed, maybe can't change. People said the same thing about Hrbek...why can't a first baseman who's 6'4', 240 pounds (I'm being kind ) hit 30+ homers every year? Well, Hrbek was never that kind of hitter. He hit over 30 homers once in his career. Yes, he could hit for power and sometimes did. But he also hit well to the opposite field when he was behind in the count, because he was a pretty solid contact hitter. I think if you ask a guy like that to pull the ball it may come at the expense of lowering his average and on-base percentage...and for what, 4 or 5 more homers a year? Is it worth it? I'll leave it to the statistics wonks to answer that one.

Kent Hrbek hit 20+ HRs in 10 of his 12 full seasons.

:

compartmentalizing and picking out certain phrases from people's posts to make your own point about a cerain hitter is what is funny to me.

[Bushwood Gopher]

"People said the same thing about Hrbek."
"Sometimes he hit for power."

It would seem the overall point you are making is comparing the two, with implying that both were/are good contact hitters who went the opposite way while not being as big of a power hitter as their critics would have wanted. Mauer will hit 20+ home runs once in his career while Hrbek did it 10 times--which I believe makes it...not a good comparison. Unless I'm misreading something, I don't think I was taking 3 or 4 words out of context to make a counterpoint.

[streakygopher]

"People said the same thing about Hrbek."
"Sometimes he hit for power."

It would seem the overall point you are making is comparing the two, with implying that both were/are good contact hitters who went the opposite way while not being as big of a power hitter as their critics would have wanted. Mauer will hit 20+ home runs once in his career while Hrbek did it 10 times--which I believe makes it...not a good comparison. Unless I'm misreading something, I don't think I was taking 3 or 4 words out of context to make a counterpoint.

The point I was hoping for is that both players were exactly what the Twins knew they had when they signed them. If they would have asked Hrbek or if the do ask Mauer to change his approach at the plate, I think the Twins would trade average for home run production and end up with a head case at the plate. Would it be worth the trade?

[Slap Shot]

"People said the same thing about Hrbek."
"Sometimes he hit for power."

It would seem the overall point you are making is comparing the two, with implying that both were/are good contact hitters who went the opposite way while not being as big of a power hitter as their critics would have wanted. Mauer will hit 20+ home runs once in his career while Hrbek did it 10 times--which I believe makes it...not a good comparison. Unless I'm misreading something, I don't think I was taking 3 or 4 words out of context to make a counterpoint.

The point I was hoping for is that both players were exactly what the Twins knew they had when they signed them. If they would have asked Hrbek or if the do ask Mauer to change his approach at the plate, I think the Twins would trade average for home run production and end up with a head case at the plate. Would it be worth the trade?

What allowed Mauer to have the pwr numbers he had in '09 while being a potential head case? Mauer is not a weakling, has a good eye at the plate and can clearly make contact. He seems to want to slap the ball more than drive it and I believe he could be a 22-27, 90+ type without sacrificing much of anything if he wanted to.

[streakygopher]

"People said the same thing about Hrbek."
"Sometimes he hit for power."

It would seem the overall point you are making is comparing the two, with implying that both were/are good contact hitters who went the opposite way while not being as big of a power hitter as their critics would have wanted. Mauer will hit 20+ home runs once in his career while Hrbek did it 10 times--which I believe makes it...not a good comparison. Unless I'm misreading something, I don't think I was taking 3 or 4 words out of context to make a counterpoint.

The point I was hoping for is that both players were exactly what the Twins knew they had when they signed them. If they would have asked Hrbek or if the do ask Mauer to change his approach at the plate, I think the Twins would trade average for home run production and end up with a head case at the plate. Would it be worth the trade?

What allowed Mauer to have the pwr numbers he had in '09 while being a potential head case? Mauer is not a weakling, has a good eye at the plate and can clearly make contact. He seems to want to slap the ball more than drive it and I believe he could be a 22-27, 90+ type without sacrificing much of anything if he wanted to.

Well, this it the part nobody knows, because he's not changing his approach! So, is it a Mauer problem or a Twins' management problem? So far this year he's got Morneau and Willingham hitting behind him, so now would be a good time to do it if he is capable.

[Five-HoleFrenzy]

Is Twins Management to bame? Or is Mauer to blame? This is a good question and maybe the answer beomes clearer if another question is asked. What is the definition of a contract? The one below sums it up pretty well.

contract 1) n. an agreement with specific terms between two or more persons or entities in which there is a promise to do something in return for a valuable benefit known as consideration.

Looking at this then blame exist with both parties as the Twins made the decision to offer up the agreement but there is also Mauer's performance side of it as well.

[team22tank]

People can blame Mauer all they want rightly or wrongly? However this team is absolutely brutal and that won't change with the pitching we have it is horrendous.

My guess is Mauer will finish this year chasing down another batting title and pushing 100 RBIs and the homers will be minimal probably around 10 and an OBP over .400. I would say with his contract and what people expect of him the only thing that needs to change is the RBI production which would ideally push 120-130/year.

Is it time to put someone else in the two spot besides Carrol?

I guess my bottom line is that this team really sucks and Mauer isn't my first concern. He could have a huge season and I don't see that changing much for this team's overall standing.

[Handyman]

I dont think Mauer will be anywhere near the batting title come the end of August.

[team22tank]

I dont think Mauer will be anywhere near the batting title come the end of August.

Any reasoning behind that statement? What do you think he will hit? If there is one thing that would be tough to criticize the guy about it would be hitting for average and if last year was an anomaly and he feels back to normal I would bet he hits somewhere in the .330 range. Now his other production numbers who knows and definitely up from some criticizing but average I think will be up there.

[h8red]

People can blame Mauer all they want rightly or wrongly? However this team is absolutely brutal and that won't change with the pitching we have it is horrendous.

My guess is Mauer will finish this year chasing down another batting title and pushing 100 RBIs and the homers will be minimal probably around 10 and an OBP over .400. I would say with his contract and what people expect of him the only thing that needs to change is the RBI production which would ideally push 120-130/year.

Is it time to put someone else in the two spot besides Carrol?

I guess my bottom line is that this team really sucks and Mauer isn't my first concern. He could have a huge season and I don't see that changing much for this team's overall standing.

That's fine but he should at least put up MVP type numbers for the type of contract he signed. Back in the day when they were also very bad it was always fun rooting for & watching to see what Puckett would do at every at bat. At least make it entertaining to watch.

[Greyeagle]

I dont think Mauer will be anywhere near the batting title come the end of August.

Any reasoning behind that statement? What do you think he will hit? If there is one thing that would be tough to criticize the guy about it would be hitting for average and if last year was an anomaly and he feels back to normal I would bet he hits somewhere in the .330 range. Now his other production numbers who knows and definitely up from some criticizing but average I think will be up there.

Handy hopes someone will disagree with him so he can pull out some stats to prove he's right and when someone uses other stats to prove him wrong he will get on them for using stats. Or, something like that.

[Handyman]

I dont think Mauer will be anywhere near the batting title come the end of August.

Any reasoning behind that statement? What do you think he will hit? If there is one thing that would be tough to criticize the guy about it would be hitting for average and if last year was an anomaly and he feels back to normal I would bet he hits somewhere in the .330 range. Now his other production numbers who knows and definitely up from some criticizing but average I think will be up there.

Well first of all I dont think he will be healthy all year. It is hard for anyone to be healthy most of the season and with his history of injury and the fact that most of the team around him would be better off playing Mickey Mantle as opposed to Major League ball I think as the dog days of summer wear on his days off will grow in number for various reasons. Not that I blame him or Gardy for that, no use forcing him to play if the team is gonna get smoked anyways. (see also: Peterson, Adrian)

I think he will probably bat around .310 or so. It is just a hunch really but I dont think this is a year that he makes a push for it. The rest of the team at some point is going to act as an anchor.

Hey old guy, not all stats are created equal. There is probably a stat out there that says St. Pauls roads make sense or Joel Maturi was an outstanding AD or that old people like yourself are actually young or that Hamline has an athletic department that is worth a damn but we all know the truth

[dryfly]

Imagine being an Angels fan, they have twice the payroll, and only one more win

Or imagine being a Royals fan. 2/3 the payroll but five times the potential.

Twins humping the Royals pretty good so far today - if they win the teams will be tied at the bottom at 6-15 [I believe], with the worst records in baseball and on pace to lose 100+. Is it common that two teams in the same league [let alone division] both lose 100 games in the same year? Seems improbable in a zero sum set up like MLB.

I can't remember that happening before. Anyone?

[Bash Brother]

Nice flyout by Willingham with 2 on and a 3-0 count.

[Bash Brother]

Despite their best efforts the Twins do manage to come away with a win today.

[Chris83]

Nice flyout by Willingham with 2 on and a 3-0 count.

Probably tired from the single, double, triple, 2 RBI and 2 runs scored earlier...and raising his BA to .353

[Bash Brother]

Nice flyout by Willingham with 2 on and a 3-0 count.

Probably tired from the single, double, triple, 2 RBI and 2 runs scored earlier...and raising his BA to .353

In that case lets forgive this years twins, they're probably tired from the '91 world series.

[Handyman]

In that case lets forgive this years twins, they're probably tired from the '91 world series.

Ok now that is funny I dont care what your opinion of the team is

[sec 16 row16 seat 16 17]

time for the pitching coach to take some heat.

[Bash Brother]

time for the pitching coach to take some heat.

You mean because our starters try their very best to put us way behind, and if they don't, Capps does his best to blow it?

[sec 16 row16 seat 16 17]

something to that effect THE MOLE.

[Chris83]

Nice flyout by Willingham with 2 on and a 3-0 count.

Probably tired from the single, double, triple, 2 RBI and 2 runs scored earlier...and raising his BA to .353

In that case lets forgive this years twins, they're probably tired from the '91 world series.

3-5 with 2 RBI he can take naps in the dugout if he likes

[Bash Brother]

Nice flyout by Willingham with 2 on and a 3-0 count.

Probably tired from the single, double, triple, 2 RBI and 2 runs scored earlier...and raising his BA to .353

In that case lets forgive this years twins, they're probably tired from the '91 world series.

3-5 with 2 RBI he can take naps in the dugout if he likes

Past performance should not excuse mistakes.

[WPoSforever]

Nice flyout by Willingham with 2 on and a 3-0 count.

Probably tired from the single, double, triple, 2 RBI and 2 runs scored earlier...and raising his BA to .353

In that case lets forgive this years twins, they're probably tired from the '91 world series.

3-5 with 2 RBI he can take naps in the dugout if he likes

Past performance should not excuse mistakes.

I have to ask, are you being serious here? I have no problem with him having the green light on a 3-0 pitch. The pitcher will almost always throw a fastball over the heart of the plate and will most likely be the best pitch to hit over the entire at bat.

[Bash Brother]

I have no problem with giving him the green light. If he is going to swing 3-0 with 2 on it better be a pitch he isn't going to weakly pop up.

[Chris83]

Nice flyout by Willingham with 2 on and a 3-0 count.

Probably tired from the single, double, triple, 2 RBI and 2 runs scored earlier...and raising his BA to .353

In that case lets forgive this years twins, they're probably tired from the '91 world series.

3-5 with 2 RBI he can take naps in the dugout if he likes

Past performance should not excuse mistakes.

Well, when you find the perfect, mistake-free player please let all of us know. Until then, I'll gladly take someone who is on pace for nearly 40 home runs and 115+ RBI.

[Bash Brother]

Well, when you find the perfect, mistake-free player please let all of us know. Until then, I'll gladly take someone who is on pace for nearly 40 home runs and 115+ RBI.

I am not talking about on pace for anything. Popping up a 3-0 pitch with 2 on is not good. That was a mistake. His other at bats may have been good but that one was not.

[sunbone]

Well, when you find the perfect, mistake-free player please let all of us know. Until then, I'll gladly take someone who is on pace for nearly 40 home runs and 115+ RBI.

I am not talking about on pace for anything. Popping up a 3-0 pitch with 2 on is not good. That was a mistake. His other at bats may have been good but that one was not.

Wow, I guess if we are going to completely nitpick then I can mention that Valencia totally sucked in that at bat where he struck out.

[Beauner]

Well, when you find the perfect, mistake-free player please let all of us know. Until then, I'll gladly take someone who is on pace for nearly 40 home runs and 115+ RBI.

I am not talking about on pace for anything. Popping up a 3-0 pitch with 2 on is not good. That was a mistake. His other at bats may have been good but that one was not.

He was a HR away from the cycle.
We had a 4 run lead in the bottom of the 8th.
He went up there with the sole intent to try to hit one out, and as many hitters will do when they try to hit one out he got under the ball and hit a shallow fly ball to RF.

Anybody who didn't see that coming when he got up 3-0 either wasn't paying attention to the game or is delusional to think he wasn't going to try to go yard that whole at-bat.

[gopher wes]

It didn't matter what the count was, he was swinging for the fences there regardless I'd imagine. As would anyone who was going for the cycle. This season has thoroughly sucked thus far in many aspects but ripping on what is, by far, the teams best hitter is laughable. Especially in game like yesterday where they were up fairly big.

I still don't know if mole was joking or not.

[sunbone]

My only complaint about Willingham is he took a 3 day paternity leave. When did this rule come into being? I'm not a fan. Maybe one day I could see, but not three.

[Armadillo]

My only complaint about Willingham is he took a 3 day paternity leave. When did this rule come into being? I'm not a fan. Maybe one day I could see, but not three.

Now THAT is some epic nitpicking right there.

[hrbekroenick]

My only complaint about Willingham is he took a 3 day paternity leave. When did this rule come into being? I'm not a fan. Maybe one day I could see, but not three.

Now THAT is some epic nitpicking right there.

So next time he should tell his wife "What What, in the butt"

[sunbone]

My only complaint about Willingham is he took a 3 day paternity leave. When did this rule come into being? I'm not a fan. Maybe one day I could see, but not three.

Now THAT is some epic nitpicking right there.

He is getting paid $7 million a year. Have your kids in the offseason. But I guess I should cut him some slack. He is a baseball player and probably couldn't do the math.

[gopher wes]

My only complaint about Willingham is he took a 3 day paternity leave. When did this rule come into being? I'm not a fan. Maybe one day I could see, but not three.

Now THAT is some epic nitpicking right there.

He is getting paid $7 million a year. Have your kids in the offseason. But I guess I should cut him some slack. He is a baseball player and probably couldn't do the math.

For serious?

[gopher_fan_in_sue_land]

My only complaint about Willingham is he took a 3 day paternity leave. When did this rule come into being? I'm not a fan. Maybe one day I could see, but not three.

Now THAT is some epic nitpicking right there.

He is getting paid $7 million a year. Have your kids in the offseason. But I guess I should cut him some slack. He is a baseball player and probably couldn't do the math.

For serious?

That is one of the most ridiculous things I have ever heard. Proposterous Statement Tournament champion type stuff.

Its a couple F'n baseball games (for a bad team). Baseball is a job to these guys, and a few days off for the birth of ones' child is certainly understandable. People never cease to amaze me.

[gopher wes]

I'm hoping sunbone is just trying to stir the pot and create some entertainment with how pathetic the Twins are this year but I really can't tell for sure. It's not like he is the first guy in the history of professional sports to take a couple games off for the birth of their child.

[sunbone]

I was being somewhat facetious. But I do think 3 days is a bit much. These guys do have a 6 month offseason. It isn't "just a job", these guys make a ton of dough to do what they do. Maybe I'm just old school. Go and be there for the birth, then get your butt back to work. Hell, I bet even Mauer wouldn't miss 3 days for "paternity leave."

[Riff Raff]

here we go again.....

http://www.foxsportsnorth.com/04/30/12/Morneau-injures-surgically-repaired-wris/landing_twins.html?blockID=720768&feedID=3697&from=foxsports/MLB+Baseball/headlines

[Six Hole]

here we go again.....

http://www.foxsportsnorth.com/04/30/12/Morneau-injures-surgically-repaired-wris/landing_twins.html?blockID=720768&feedID=3697&from=foxsports/MLB+Baseball/headlines

It gets worse: Butera is on his way up.

[Beauner]

I was being somewhat facetious. But I do think 3 days is a bit much. These guys do have a 6 month offseason. It isn't "just a job", these guys make a ton of dough to do what they do. Maybe I'm just old school. Go and be there for the birth, then get your butt back to work. Hell, I bet even Mauer wouldn't miss 3 days for "paternity leave."

Mauer can't miss 3 days for paternity leave. He'd miss 3 months for maternity leave.

[Armadillo]

I was being somewhat facetious. But I do think 3 days is a bit much. These guys do have a 6 month offseason. It isn't "just a job", these guys make a ton of dough to do what they do. Maybe I'm just old school. Go and be there for the birth, then get your butt back to work. Hell, I bet even Mauer wouldn't miss 3 days for "paternity leave."

Mauer can't miss 3 days for paternity leave. He'd miss 3 months for maternity leave.

So sunbone, would you have been OK with 70 hours instead of the 72 he did take?

I mean...that's just taking athlete jealousy to a new level.

[sunbone]

So sunbone, would you have been OK with 70 hours instead of the 72 he did take?

I mean...that's just taking athlete jealousy to a new level.

I just think it is a dumb policy. Did it matter this year? No, because the Twins suck. But would it be okay if it is September and the team is tied for first and a guy decides to take 3 days off to change diapers or whatever it is he was doing? And I'm not sure what I'm supposedly jealous about. I can take 3 days off any time I want. And I have zero interest in having a baby.

[Armadillo]

So sunbone, would you have been OK with 70 hours instead of the 72 he did take?

I mean...that's just taking athlete jealousy to a new level.

I just think it is a dumb policy. Did it matter this year? No, because the Twins suck. But would it be okay if it is September and the team is tied for first and a guy decides to take 3 days off to change diapers or whatever it is he was doing? And I'm not sure what I'm supposedly jealous about. I can take 3 days off any time I want. And I have zero interest in having a baby.

He took three days...not a week, not a month...THREE DAYS...to visit his wife and newborn child, and you're prattling on like he abandoned his team for a Las Vegas hookers-n-blow binge.

I think the reason many of us aren't able to articulate our feelings about this very well is that it's one of the stranger criticisms we've ever heard.

[sunbone]

So sunbone, would you have been OK with 70 hours instead of the 72 he did take?

I mean...that's just taking athlete jealousy to a new level.

I just think it is a dumb policy. Did it matter this year? No, because the Twins suck. But would it be okay if it is September and the team is tied for first and a guy decides to take 3 days off to change diapers or whatever it is he was doing? And I'm not sure what I'm supposedly jealous about. I can take 3 days off any time I want. And I have zero interest in having a baby.

He took three days...not a week, not a month...THREE DAYS...to visit his wife and newborn child, and you're prattling on like he abandoned his team for a Las Vegas hookers-n-blow binge.

I think the reason many of us aren't able to articulate our feelings about this very well is that it's one of the stranger criticisms we've ever heard.

Come on, be fair. I am not prattling on like he pulled a Delmon.

[psych]

So sunbone, would you have been OK with 70 hours instead of the 72 he did take?

I mean...that's just taking athlete jealousy to a new level.

I just think it is a dumb policy. Did it matter this year? No, because the Twins suck. But would it be okay if it is September and the team is tied for first and a guy decides to take 3 days off to change diapers or whatever it is he was doing? And I'm not sure what I'm supposedly jealous about. I can take 3 days off any time I want. And I have zero interest in having a baby.

He took three days...not a week, not a month...THREE DAYS...to visit his wife and newborn child, and you're prattling on like he abandoned his team for a Las Vegas hookers-n-blow binge.
I think the reason many of us aren't able to articulate our feelings about this very well is that it's one of the stranger criticisms we've ever heard.

That made me think of this:

[dryfly]

I was being somewhat facetious. But I do think 3 days is a bit much. These guys do have a 6 month offseason. It isn't "just a job", these guys make a ton of dough to do what they do. Maybe I'm just old school. Go and be there for the birth, then get your butt back to work. Hell, I bet even Mauer wouldn't miss 3 days for "paternity leave."

Mauer can't miss 3 days for paternity leave. He'd miss 3 months for maternity leave.

C Sections take a long time to heal. Cut him some slack.

[Bushwood Gopher]

Did you guys catch that? Roy Smalley just confirmed aloud what I used to joke about the Twins and then gradually came to actually believe: "It's ok to give up a bunch of solo home runs, just don't walk any guys."

Is it any wonder why we are where we're at with this kind of dumbass lunacy?

We'll dump Liriano to the Rays for a bucket of balls before the trade deadline, and they'll figure out how to make him either a 20 game winner or a stud closer.

[The Rube]

So sunbone, would you have been OK with 70 hours instead of the 72 he did take?

I mean...that's just taking athlete jealousy to a new level.

I just think it is a dumb policy. Did it matter this year? No, because the Twins suck. But would it be okay if it is September and the team is tied for first and a guy decides to take 3 days off to change diapers or whatever it is he was doing? And I'm not sure what I'm supposedly jealous about. I can take 3 days off any time I want. And I have zero interest in having a baby.

He took three days...not a week, not a month...THREE DAYS...to visit his wife and newborn child, and you're prattling on like he abandoned his team for a Las Vegas hookers-n-blow binge.

I think the reason many of us aren't able to articulate our feelings about this very well is that it's one of the stranger criticisms we've ever heard.

Yep. Three days. It's hard to do a case-by-case (oh, it happens when you're on a homestand? You get one day. On the road? 3 days, to help with travel time).

Sheesh. A new low in nitpicking in MN fandom.

[team22tank]

The Twins suck that is all there is to it.

All professional teams in MN suck right now and the Twins are on their way to sucking the most.

[Five-HoleFrenzy]

When you think about it (and you probably shouldn't), how embarrassing is it that the Yankees lost 2 games to this squad?

[sunbone]

Did you guys catch that? Roy Smalley just confirmed aloud what I used to joke about the Twins and then gradually came to actually believe: "It's ok to give up a bunch of solo home runs, just don't walk any guys."

Is it any wonder why we are where we're at with this kind of dumbass lunacy?

We'll dump Liriano to the Rays for a bucket of balls before the trade deadline, and they'll figure out how to make him either a 20 game winner or a stud closer.

Kind of like how Delmon was going to turn into a triple crown threat once he got away from Vavra?

[dxmnkd316]

Did you guys catch that? Roy Smalley just confirmed aloud what I used to joke about the Twins and then gradually came to actually believe: "It's ok to give up a bunch of solo home runs, just don't walk any guys."

Is it any wonder why we are where we're at with this kind of dumbass lunacy?

We'll dump Liriano to the Rays for a bucket of balls before the trade deadline, and they'll figure out how to make him either a 20 game winner or a stud closer.

Kind of like how Delmon was going to turn into a triple crown threat once he got away from Vavra?

A triple crown threat brought down by a hate crime. Such a sad story...

[Don Adams Wheel of Justice]

We'll dump Liriano to the Rays for a bucket of balls before the trade deadline, and they'll figure out how to make him either a 20 game winner or a stud closer.

Not a chance. Look at his delivery. Stride is way too long, still does the "inverted W", and recoils violently. He'll need a 2nd Tommy John surgery within 2 years. Book it.

http://www.twincities.com/portlet/artic ... Id=4384469

[Beauner]

We'll dump Liriano to the Rays for a bucket of balls before the trade deadline, and they'll figure out how to make him either a 20 game winner or a stud closer.

Not a chance. Look at his delivery. Stride is way too long, still does the "inverted W", and recoils violently. He'll need a 2nd Tommy John surgery within 2 years. Book it.

http://www.twincities.com/portlet/artic ... Id=4384469

The "perfect" stride length is supposed to be 85-90% of a person's height. Does Tim Lincecum over-stride too?
If you look at the picture, his upper body is perfectly balanced over his lower body (if he was overstriding his upper body would generally be ahead of his lower body).
As for the "inverted W" (or as we called it in high school--Scap Loading--pinching the elbows behind the back), almost every single major league pitcher does that to one extent or another. If they didn't, they wouldn't be able to throw it 90+ mph. What we were told in high school is that a slower stride to the plate would mean more "scap load" and Liriano has a pretty slow stride to the plate.
If he's trying to do it intentionally, that is one thing (it is generally a better idea to generate velocity from your legs than your upper body), but if it is a result of his slow stride that is another. Look at guys like Greg Maddux--he had a pretty big scap load at one point in his career too.

The violent recoil is dead on. It looks ugly. I think he over-rotates his hips to try to generate extra velocity and bite on his slider, which is probably going to end up causing him to get hurt again. For some reason, he seems like he's really afraid to let loose with his upper half and is over-using his push-off which puts him in terrible position after the release (like he's jumping at the plate).

[Don Adams Wheel of Justice]

This series against the Angels has been brutal to watch. This type of effort, or lack thereof, is what gets managers and pitching coaches fired.