new super conference (NCHC)

Talk about College Hockey other than the Gophers...

Re: new super conference

Postby LeoPohl » Thu 7/14/11 9:43 am

psych wrote:
mrscharf wrote:
CollegeHockeyAddict wrote:If the WCHA ends up being St. Cloud, Mankato, Bemedji, Anchorage, Michigan Tech, and Northern Michigan one posibility to have a centerally located neautral conference tournament would be to hold it in Duluth. If Bruce McCloud stays as the comissioner of the revised WCHA this possibility is probably quite strong with his ties to Duluth. Duluth is also the largest area that is centrally located.

I think there is a good chance that the Big 10 tournament will be held at the X after a few years of the conference. I doubt the conference is going to have the championship weekend at the top seed's campus arena for more then a couple of years.


With two Michagan teams plus Ohio St. and Penn St., Look for it to go to the Joe in Detroit.


God I hope not. At the very least, alternate it between the X and the Joe.

There are three CCHA and two WCHA schools here with one loner, who would likely side with JLA due to it's geographical and football connections. The other WCHA school whined incessantly (at least it's fans did) about Minnesota getting home ice advantage every year. The Big 10 loves centrally located Chicago, and Minnesota is the west coast as far as it's concerned. I would be very surprised if the X ever gets the conference tournament full-time. My bet is either full-time at the United Center, home to Big10 non-playing Northwestern, or gets rotated about. And if it did come down between the JLA and the X, I'd say the JLA gets picked first. We're not dealing with hockey people; if we were we wouldn't be having this discussion in the first place.
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Re: new super conference

Postby WPoS » Thu 7/14/11 9:52 am

mrscharf wrote:
CollegeHockeyAddict wrote:If the WCHA ends up being St. Cloud, Mankato, Bemedji, Anchorage, Michigan Tech, and Northern Michigan one posibility to have a centerally located neautral conference tournament would be to hold it in Duluth. If Bruce McCloud stays as the comissioner of the revised WCHA this possibility is probably quite strong with his ties to Duluth. Duluth is also the largest area that is centrally located.

I think there is a good chance that the Big 10 tournament will be held at the X after a few years of the conference. I doubt the conference is going to have the championship weekend at the top seed's campus arena for more then a couple of years.


With two Michagan teams plus Ohio St. and Penn St., Look for it to go to the Joe in Detroit.


and it being empty....

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Re: new super conference

Postby Always Lurking » Thu 7/14/11 9:56 am

LeoPohl wrote:We're not dealing with hockey people; if we were we wouldn't be having this discussion in the first place.


As such, it wouldn't surprise me if the people in charge picked this "centrally located" facility on the outskirts of Indianapolis :roll:
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Re: new super conference

Postby Crocshots » Thu 7/14/11 9:58 am

Always Lurking wrote:
LeoPohl wrote:We're not dealing with hockey people; if we were we wouldn't be having this discussion in the first place.


As such, it wouldn't surprise me if the people in charge picked this "centrally located" facility on the outskirts of Indianapolis :roll:
http://www.indianaice.com/tickets/area-info-directions/


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Re: new super conference

Postby streakygopher » Thu 7/14/11 10:38 am

WPoS wrote:
mrscharf wrote:
CollegeHockeyAddict wrote:If the WCHA ends up being St. Cloud, Mankato, Bemedji, Anchorage, Michigan Tech, and Northern Michigan one posibility to have a centerally located neautral conference tournament would be to hold it in Duluth. If Bruce McCloud stays as the comissioner of the revised WCHA this possibility is probably quite strong with his ties to Duluth. Duluth is also the largest area that is centrally located.

I think there is a good chance that the Big 10 tournament will be held at the X after a few years of the conference. I doubt the conference is going to have the championship weekend at the top seed's campus arena for more then a couple of years.


With two Michagan teams plus Ohio St. and Penn St., Look for it to go to the Joe in Detroit.


and it being empty....

W

Guessing that after a few years of counting receipts at various venues they'll figure out where the money is.
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Re: new super conference

Postby LeoPohl » Thu 7/14/11 10:57 am

streakygopher wrote:
WPoS wrote:
mrscharf wrote:
CollegeHockeyAddict wrote:If the WCHA ends up being St. Cloud, Mankato, Bemedji, Anchorage, Michigan Tech, and Northern Michigan one posibility to have a centerally located neautral conference tournament would be to hold it in Duluth. If Bruce McCloud stays as the comissioner of the revised WCHA this possibility is probably quite strong with his ties to Duluth. Duluth is also the largest area that is centrally located.

I think there is a good chance that the Big 10 tournament will be held at the X after a few years of the conference. I doubt the conference is going to have the championship weekend at the top seed's campus arena for more then a couple of years.


With two Michagan teams plus Ohio St. and Penn St., Look for it to go to the Joe in Detroit.


and it being empty....

W

Guessing that after a few years of counting receipts at various venues they'll figure out where the money is.

That's assuming Michigan doesn't let it's ego get in the way.
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Re: new super conference

Postby mnwildfan79 » Thu 7/14/11 11:15 am

LeoPohl wrote: We're not dealing with hockey people; if we were we wouldn't be having this discussion in the first place.


It doesn't matter what type of people we are dealing with, the only thing that matters is the almighty dollar.

You can say what you want about the Big Ten but they know how to make money.

I'd speculate that all things considered the powers that be will discover that a B1G tournament permanently based in St. Paul will be the most profitable.
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Re: new super conference (NCHC)

Postby SkiUMahLaw » Thu 7/14/11 11:40 am

I may be alone here, but I really enjoyed being in Detroit for the Frozen Four last year. No, the outskirts are not a place to be, but downtown Detroit was downright fun. Flights from MSP are relatively easy there, and Greektown is a blast.

Plus, the B1G may be able to have in coincide with the Tigers home opener-- which is a HUGE party encompassing all of Downtown Detroit.

If done correctly, I would consider a trip to Detroit again...but they have to do it better than how they do the basketball tournament. Yuck.
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Re: new super conference (NCHC)

Postby streakygopher » Thu 7/14/11 11:59 am

SkiUMahLaw wrote:I may be alone here, but I really enjoyed being in Detroit for the Frozen Four last year. No, the outskirts are not a place to be, but downtown Detroit was downright fun. Flights from MSP are relatively easy there, and Greektown is a blast.

Plus, the B1G may be able to have in coincide with the Tigers home opener-- which is a HUGE party encompassing all of Downtown Detroit.

If done correctly, I would consider a trip to Detroit again...but they have to do it better than how they do the basketball tournament. Yuck.

This is a good point. The experience is hotel to game to bars back to hotel. In that light, it will be a lot of fun. I think the question is can Detroit draw from other schools?
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Re: new super conference (NCHC)

Postby WPoS » Thu 7/14/11 12:56 pm

streakygopher wrote:
SkiUMahLaw wrote:I may be alone here, but I really enjoyed being in Detroit for the Frozen Four last year. No, the outskirts are not a place to be, but downtown Detroit was downright fun. Flights from MSP are relatively easy there, and Greektown is a blast.

Plus, the B1G may be able to have in coincide with the Tigers home opener-- which is a HUGE party encompassing all of Downtown Detroit.

If done correctly, I would consider a trip to Detroit again...but they have to do it better than how they do the basketball tournament. Yuck.

This is a good point. The experience is hotel to game to bars back to hotel. In that light, it will be a lot of fun. I think the question is can Detroit draw from other schools?


tailgating won't be as much fun...no way I can drag all my stuff there every year! And Viking and DeiselGopher wouldn't be able to bring home brews....

the FF wasn't bad, but I definitely would prefer the games being in St Paul. I think the Gopher faithful and maybe even the unspeakables to the East might do a good job filling the X well, and you know danm well the Sewage fans left in town would go just to root againt the Gophers.

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Re: new super conference (NCHC)

Postby gopher_ears » Thu 7/14/11 1:26 pm

WPoS wrote:
streakygopher wrote:
SkiUMahLaw wrote:I may be alone here, but I really enjoyed being in Detroit for the Frozen Four last year. No, the outskirts are not a place to be, but downtown Detroit was downright fun. Flights from MSP are relatively easy there, and Greektown is a blast.

Plus, the B1G may be able to have in coincide with the Tigers home opener-- which is a HUGE party encompassing all of Downtown Detroit.

If done correctly, I would consider a trip to Detroit again...but they have to do it better than how they do the basketball tournament. Yuck.

This is a good point. The experience is hotel to game to bars back to hotel. In that light, it will be a lot of fun. I think the question is can Detroit draw from other schools?


tailgating won't be as much fun...no way I can drag all my stuff there every year! And Viking and DeiselGopher wouldn't be able to bring home brews....

the FF wasn't bad, but I definitely would prefer the games being in St Paul. I think the Gopher faithful and maybe even the unspeakables to the East might do a good job filling the X well, and you know danm well the Sewage fans left in town would go just to root againt the Gophers.

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We might get to see them display their love for the Ugly Helmets.
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Re: new super conference (NCHC)

Postby MAP » Thu 7/14/11 3:51 pm

SkiUMahLaw wrote:I may be alone here, but I really enjoyed being in Detroit for the Frozen Four last year. No, the outskirts are not a place to be, but downtown Detroit was downright fun. Flights from MSP are relatively easy there, and Greektown is a blast.

Plus, the B1G may be able to have in coincide with the Tigers home opener-- which is a HUGE party encompassing all of Downtown Detroit.

If done correctly, I would consider a trip to Detroit again...but they have to do it better than how they do the basketball tournament. Yuck.


Oddly enough, I have the same reaction!! :wink:

And for no apparent reason and completely unrelated to my post: :ahhh:
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Re: new super conference (NCHC)

Postby psych » Thu 7/14/11 9:33 pm

gopher_ears wrote:
WPoS wrote:
streakygopher wrote:
SkiUMahLaw wrote:I may be alone here, but I really enjoyed being in Detroit for the Frozen Four last year. No, the outskirts are not a place to be, but downtown Detroit was downright fun. Flights from MSP are relatively easy there, and Greektown is a blast.

Plus, the B1G may be able to have in coincide with the Tigers home opener-- which is a HUGE party encompassing all of Downtown Detroit.

If done correctly, I would consider a trip to Detroit again...but they have to do it better than how they do the basketball tournament. Yuck.

This is a good point. The experience is hotel to game to bars back to hotel. In that light, it will be a lot of fun. I think the question is can Detroit draw from other schools?


tailgating won't be as much fun...no way I can drag all my stuff there every year! And Viking and DeiselGopher wouldn't be able to bring home brews....

the FF wasn't bad, but I definitely would prefer the games being in St Paul. I think the Gopher faithful and maybe even the unspeakables to the East might do a good job filling the X well, and you know danm well the Sewage fans left in town would go just to root againt the Gophers.

W


Image

We might get to see them display their love for the Ugly Helmets.


That is still my facebook profile pic...I love it that much. :mrgreen:
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Re: new super conference (NCHC)

Postby The Rube » Fri 7/15/11 12:12 am

What college hockey organizations see:
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What the fans see:

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Re: new super conference (NCHC)

Postby Maize » Fri 7/15/11 12:57 am

SkiUMahLaw wrote:I may be alone here, but I really enjoyed being in Detroit for the Frozen Four last year. No, the outskirts are not a place to be, but downtown Detroit was downright fun. Flights from MSP are relatively easy there, and Greektown is a blast.

Plus, the B1G may be able to have in coincide with the Tigers home opener-- which is a HUGE party encompassing all of Downtown Detroit.

If done correctly, I would consider a trip to Detroit again...but they have to do it better than how they do the basketball tournament. Yuck.


You're absolutely correct. Though I should point out that flights may be easy, but not cheap. Detroit and St. Paul are both great venues if the local team is playing. If they're out of it, I doubt it'd be that great. I don't see it being the type of event people make huge travel plans around, which is why they're probably better off at campus sites.
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Re: new super conference

Postby LeoPohl » Fri 7/15/11 10:18 am

mnwildfan79 wrote:
LeoPohl wrote: We're not dealing with hockey people; if we were we wouldn't be having this discussion in the first place.


It doesn't matter what type of people we are dealing with, the only thing that matters is the almighty dollar.

You can say what you want about the Big Ten but they know how to make money.

I'd speculate that all things considered the powers that be will discover that a B1G tournament permanently based in St. Paul will be the most profitable.

There is still a giant school who is king of the Big10 and enjoys playing close to home at JLA. It also plays in a state that likes to fashion itself as "the" hockey state. Don't rule out politics both in and out of the conference playing a role. The WCHA schools don't have the egos that the Big10 schools have.
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Re: new super conference (NCHC)

Postby trixR4kids » Fri 7/15/11 12:37 pm

In the end it's about money and they'll do whatever is most profitable.
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Re: new super conference (NCHC)

Postby WestCoastGopherGuy » Sat 7/16/11 12:10 am

itll be interesting to see if nodak changes their name or works something out so they can play the big ten. every other team in the nchc can play minnesota, wisconsin, michigan and michigan state, but the sioux cannot. thats gotta hurt.

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Re: new super conference

Postby mnwildfan79 » Sat 7/16/11 8:41 am

LeoPohl wrote:
mnwildfan79 wrote:
LeoPohl wrote: We're not dealing with hockey people; if we were we wouldn't be having this discussion in the first place.


It doesn't matter what type of people we are dealing with, the only thing that matters is the almighty dollar.

You can say what you want about the Big Ten but they know how to make money.

I'd speculate that all things considered the powers that be will discover that a B1G tournament permanently based in St. Paul will be the most profitable.

There is still a giant school who is king of the Big10 and enjoys playing close to home at JLA. It also plays in a state that likes to fashion itself as "the" hockey state. Don't rule out politics both in and out of the conference playing a role. The WCHA schools don't have the egos that the Big10 schools have.


I don't buy that Ugly Helmet University has any more pull than anyone else involved in the BTHC.

It wasn't about ego/lack of ego for the WCHA schools either, it was about the large check they got when the X sold out for the Final Five every single year. B1G is a money making enterprise. It may appear larger schools get preferential treatment because of this, however in this particular case my argument is WE hold the most power because we can present the best opportunity to maximize profits.
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Re: new super conference (NCHC)

Postby dxmnkd316 » Sat 7/16/11 2:33 pm

Can one support the new super conference and hope they win it all for the next ten years straight while still being a Gopher fan?
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Re: new super conference (NCHC)

Postby st8ofhockey » Sat 7/16/11 3:05 pm

dxmnkd316 wrote:Can one support the new super conference and hope they win it all for the next ten years straight while still being a Gopher fan?


What would be one's motivation in doing so? I get that they're doing what is in their own best interest, so I don't wish failure upon them in principle. But, IMHO, what is "good" for college hockey will be for the left behinds of the 2 leagues to succeed in spite of realignment. The Minnesotas, North Dakotas, and Michigans of the world will still be regarded as top-tier in hockey - based solely on reputation - for years to come. The Bemidjis and NMUs can't say that - and those are the Universities I'll be pulling for as this goes forward.

Welcome back, btw
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Re: new super conference (NCHC)

Postby dxmnkd316 » Sat 7/16/11 3:35 pm

st8ofhockey wrote:
dxmnkd316 wrote:Can one support the new super conference and hope they win it all for the next ten years straight while still being a Gopher fan?


What would be one's motivation in doing so? I get that they're doing what is in their own best interest, so I don't wish failure upon them in principle. But, IMHO, what is "good" for college hockey will be for the left behinds of the 2 leagues to succeed in spite of realignment. The Minnesotas, North Dakotas, and Michigans of the world will still be regarded as top-tier in hockey - based solely on reputation - for years to come. The Bemidjis and NMUs can't say that - and those are the Universities I'll be pulling for as this goes forward.

Welcome back, btw


I dunno, I think it's a nose, face, spite kind of thing. I can't forgive the Big Ten for what they did. I'd like nothing better to see the Big Ten fail spectacularly.

(thanks!)
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Re: new super conference (NCHC)

Postby Hammy » Sat 7/16/11 3:58 pm

Seriously? Get over it. :roll:
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Re: new super conference (NCHC)

Postby dxmnkd316 » Sat 7/16/11 4:32 pm

Hammy wrote:Seriously? Get over it. :roll:


Below me. :roll: :roll:
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Re: new super conference (NCHC)

Postby Hammy » Sat 7/16/11 4:44 pm

Respond however you wish but you look like a pouting child that got his toy taken away with that kind of commentary.

If you wish ill will on the league, it is basically wishing ill will on the Gophers since the league's success helps the Gopher program in more than one way. If you really feel that way, you may as well drop the Gopher allegiance and look elsewhere for a team to cheer.

Not saying you have to like their choice but to want it to fail miserably like that? Pathetic.
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Re: new super conference (NCHC)

Postby mnwildfan79 » Sat 7/16/11 5:12 pm

dxmnkd316 wrote:
st8ofhockey wrote:
dxmnkd316 wrote:Can one support the new super conference and hope they win it all for the next ten years straight while still being a Gopher fan?


What would be one's motivation in doing so? I get that they're doing what is in their own best interest, so I don't wish failure upon them in principle. But, IMHO, what is "good" for college hockey will be for the left behinds of the 2 leagues to succeed in spite of realignment. The Minnesotas, North Dakotas, and Michigans of the world will still be regarded as top-tier in hockey - based solely on reputation - for years to come. The Bemidjis and NMUs can't say that - and those are the Universities I'll be pulling for as this goes forward.

Welcome back, btw


I dunno, I think it's a nose, face, spite kind of thing. I can't forgive the Big Ten for what they did. I'd like nothing better to see the Big Ten fail spectacularly.

(thanks!)


What does the NCHC winning the next 10 NC's have to do with the Big Ten failing spectacularly?
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Re: new super conference (NCHC)

Postby Armadillo » Sat 7/16/11 6:09 pm

I want to see both the Big Ten and NCHC fail spectacularly, even with the Gophers winning every Big Ten and NCAA title in the time period. Once this has happened, I want to see the WCHA reform, with Northern Michigan replacing the excommunicated North Dakota, whose program has been banished from all planes of existence for eternity, and the Ralph converted into the world's largest open-pit Biffy.
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Re: new super conference (NCHC)

Postby Dances With Gophers » Sat 7/16/11 6:12 pm

I want both league to succeed like gang-busters, with Sue finishing DFL each and every season.
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Re: new super conference (NCHC)

Postby Armadillo » Sat 7/16/11 6:19 pm

Dances With Gophers wrote:I want both league to succeed like gang-busters, with Sue finishing DFL each and every season.


Could you kindly keep politics out of this? :mrgreen:
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Re: new super conference (NCHC)

Postby CollegeHockeyAddict » Sat 7/16/11 6:24 pm

Dances With Gophers wrote:I want both league to succeed like gang-busters, with Sue finishing DFL each and every season.


No politics on GPL :D

and yes I know DFL in this case stands for dead "freaking" :wink: last

EDIT: Damn, Dillo beat me to the punch.
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Re: new super conference (NCHC)

Postby Armadillo » Sat 7/16/11 6:38 pm

CollegeHockeyAddict wrote:EDIT: Damn, Dillo beat me to the punch.


Image
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Re: new super conference (NCHC)

Postby gopher6 » Sat 7/16/11 7:18 pm

dxmnkd316 wrote:Can one support the new super conference and hope they win it all for the next ten years straight while still being a Gopher fan?


I thought I was the one who started drinking early today :shots:
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Re: new super conference (NCHC)

Postby Slap Shot » Sat 7/16/11 7:41 pm

dxmnkd316 wrote:Can one support the new super conference and hope they win it all for the next ten years straight while still being a Gopher fan?


I can't rationalize how.
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Re: new super conference (NCHC)

Postby Norm » Sat 7/16/11 7:50 pm

dxmnkd316 wrote:Can one support the new super conference and hope they win it all for the next ten years straight while still being a Gopher fan?

No.
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Re: new super conference (NCHC)

Postby Armadillo » Sat 7/16/11 8:25 pm

Maybe something like, "I hope somebody from the NCHC wins it all if the Gophers can't" is what you were trying to say?

Also, there'd better be a Sioux exemption in your "I want the NCHC to succeed" line of thinking, or I'll stop trying to help you against the lynch mob.
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Re: new super conference (NCHC)

Postby Kelor » Sat 7/16/11 9:09 pm

LYNCH HIM!!!!

I like Armadillo's idea, except isn't it already the worlds largest biffy?
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Re: new super conference (NCHC)

Postby dxmnkd316 » Sat 7/16/11 10:58 pm

Armadillo wrote:Maybe something like, "I hope somebody from the NCHC wins it all if the Gophers can't" is what you were trying to say?


Yes this.

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Re: new super conference (NCHC)

Postby Tee09 » Sat 7/16/11 11:07 pm

I hope the Gophers, MSU, OSU, and PSU do great. Other than that, I hope the BTHC sucks too.
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Re: new super conference (NCHC)

Postby dxmnkd316 » Sat 7/16/11 11:11 pm

Screw that. PSU can rot in hell. I don't mind them in most sports, always been a big fan of JoPa.

But what they did to college hockey, what they set in motion I can't forgive. They really did ruin everything that I held dear in college hockey. But whatever, all I care is to see the Gophers win when it's all said and done.
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Re: new super conference (NCHC)

Postby Tee09 » Sat 7/16/11 11:19 pm

dxmnkd316 wrote:Screw that. PSU can rot in hell. I don't mind them in most sports, always been a big fan of JoPa.

But what they did to college hockey, what they set in motion I can't forgive. They really did ruin everything that I held dear in college hockey.


I'll miss trips to Houghton, but as long as we still play Nodak and UMD, I don't care that much. The WCHA would have been fine if Denver and UND hadn't tried to start their cool kids club. CCHA, who knows.

Regardless, Penn St can have hockey if they want. Why should they have to worry about MSU-Mankato or Bemidji or Ferris State when making their decision to sponsor a D-I team? It may even be a net positive for the long term growth and national exposure of college hockey. Wait and see.
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Re: new super conference (NCHC)

Postby dxmnkd316 » Sat 7/16/11 11:23 pm

Tee09 wrote:
dxmnkd316 wrote:Screw that. PSU can rot in hell. I don't mind them in most sports, always been a big fan of JoPa.

But what they did to college hockey, what they set in motion I can't forgive. They really did ruin everything that I held dear in college hockey.


I'll miss trips to Houghton, but as long as we still play Nodak and UMD, I don't care that much. The WCHA would have been fine if Denver and UND hadn't tried to start their cool kids club. CCHA, who knows.

Regardless, Penn St can have hockey if they want. Why should they have to worry about MSU-Mankato or Bemidji or Ferris State when making their decision to sponsor a D-I team? It may even be a net positive for the long term growth and national exposure of college hockey. Wait and see.


They probably shouldn't worry about them. It could be a net positive, but I highly, highly doubt it. The sports capital of the nation (OSU) hasn't drummed up a single decent season yet. I'm not optimistic.
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Re: new super conference (NCHC)

Postby Hammy » Sun 7/17/11 12:53 am

Hoping for failure five or ten years from now as if it will somehow bring back the past is rather ridiculous at this stage. May as well keep looking forward and make the best of it. We won't be going backward to the old days of the WCHA once we get into that conference.
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Re: new super conference (NCHC)

Postby Hammy » Sun 7/17/11 1:05 am

Tee09 wrote:Regardless, Penn St can have hockey if they want. Why should they have to worry about MSU-Mankato or Bemidji or Ferris State when making their decision to sponsor a D-I team? It may even be a net positive for the long term growth and national exposure of college hockey. Wait and see.


A very balanced take on it. It will be interesting to see if Penn State has success and whether that will encourage further development among some other bigger schools. I just know that hanging on to the past with white knuckles isn't going to make matters better for college hockey. Tough to say how the sport will do down the road but I don't see it as a negative in the long haul to see another big money school investing in a program like this.
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Re: new super conference (NCHC)

Postby The Rube » Sun 7/17/11 1:52 am

I've maintained that PSU joining D1 hockey = awesome. BUT, I also maintain that the B1G Mistake is just that: a mistake. It ignited bad things for college hockey as a whole (the obvious example being the superconference). We're going to see teams die. Whether or not you believe that if they can't survive without the big schools, and therefore should fold, is irrelevant. The end sum is the same. The sport will shrink. The national tournament will probably shrink (this I am less sure of, but I won't bet against it). How does that grow the sport?

Hockey (college, in this case) is one of the most regional major sports around. How does having teams fold grow the sport? Potential? Hmm, potential made Penn St take years and years, and multiple rumors and jokes before it finally went D1. And even then it took a major donor to make it happen.

This is why people like me are mad as hell that the B1G Mistake formed. Domino Effect? I present Exhibit A.
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Re: new super conference (NCHC)

Postby Hammy » Sun 7/17/11 2:29 am

I never had a major issue with anybody that didn't like the change. My commentary here is focused on wanting it to fail (which hurts our program too). As if that makes matters "better". It's pointless at this stage. May as well look forward and support the situation.

Since we don't know if a few of these "at risk" programs would have lasted even w/o changes (not exactly thriving as it is), I'm not sure it is valid to use that as reasoning for anything either way.

While I don't like some of the things that have gone on, I'm not sure that any of us can really predict what will happen in 10 to 20 years with the sport. I'm sure many had their doubts about adding more D1 teams to MN back when it was only the U and UMD. As Tee mentioned, we'll see how it plays out. It is a niche sport but that doesn't mean growth opportunities don't exist with changes.
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Re: new super conference (NCHC)

Postby The Rube » Sun 7/17/11 2:47 am

To me, it's the wrong kind of changes.

Honestly? I'd have liked to see HE and the WCHA trim their conferences from 12 teams, and create a new conference with PSU. Some good, some bad. Say, MTU, NMU, OSU, ND, Miami, that sort of thing (purely off the top of my head at this moment, nothing more, nothing less). Geographic with a nod to balanced talent. 12 teams in a conference is too many. 10 was the apparent standard, 8 is perfect (IMO).

There's this talk of ND joining HE. Who's getting kicked out? Who's left for dead? I would say Merrimack, but that's an uneducated guess. Either way, that's one less team in the sport (theoretically). There is no way HE is having 13 teams.
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Re: new super conference (NCHC)

Postby trixR4kids » Sun 7/17/11 10:32 am

How about cheering even harder against Bucky because Alvarez is the one who had been trying to form the BTHC for a while now.
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Re: new super conference (NCHC)

Postby dxmnkd316 » Sun 7/17/11 11:13 am

Hammy wrote:Hoping for failure five or ten years from now as if it will somehow bring back the past is rather ridiculous at this stage. May as well keep looking forward and make the best of it. We won't be going backward to the old days of the WCHA once we get into that conference.


Perhaps you should reread what I said.
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Re: new super conference (NCHC)

Postby jallengarry » Sun 7/17/11 11:25 am

dxmnkd316 wrote:Screw that. PSU can rot in hell. I don't mind them in most sports, always been a big fan of JoPa.

But what they did to college hockey, what they set in motion I can't forgive. They really did ruin everything that I held dear in college hockey. But whatever, all I care is to see the Gophers win when it's all said and done.


I don't know why I'm asking, but are you just venting or do you actually believe they should have stood back and said, "we'd like hockey but we don't want to mess things up for you guys"?
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Re: new super conference (NCHC)

Postby Dances With Gophers » Sun 7/17/11 11:29 am

I'm glad PSU decided to green light their hockey program. Maybe we'll see other schools follow suit and then witness a period of growth in the college game.
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Re: new super conference (NCHC)

Postby dxmnkd316 » Sun 7/17/11 11:40 am

jallengarry wrote:
dxmnkd316 wrote:Screw that. PSU can rot in hell. I don't mind them in most sports, always been a big fan of JoPa.

But what they did to college hockey, what they set in motion I can't forgive. They really did ruin everything that I held dear in college hockey. But whatever, all I care is to see the Gophers win when it's all said and done.


I don't know why I'm asking, but are you just venting or do you actually believe they should have stood back and said, "we'd like hockey but we don't want to mess things up for you guys"?


Half right. As I said, it's just me venting (the nose, face quote) and then I also acknowledged that they shouldn't care about the other teams. Happy?
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Re: new super conference (NCHC)

Postby jallengarry » Sun 7/17/11 11:53 am

Actually it really doesn't have a huge bearing on my mood, but thanks for clarifying.
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Re: new super conference (NCHC)

Postby dxmnkd316 » Sun 7/17/11 11:57 am

jallengarry wrote:Actually it really doesn't have a huge bearing on my mood, but thanks for clarifying.


:D

This is four months of repressed anger pouring out. :anger:
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Re: new super conference (NCHC)

Postby st8ofhockey » Sun 7/17/11 12:33 pm

I think I relate to where dx is coming from, but I think my sentiment aligns more with tRube's train of thought... a school adding Division I hockey is a good thing when viewed in a vacuum; it's the context of the situation that makes it blow. I do think it's realistic for PSU to have stood back and said "we're going to add college hockey, but a lot of people feel strongly about this issue, so let's put every opinion on the table as we start our program to ensure it doesn't mess up what's already a niche sport." I feel realignment could have been done successfully - benefiting both PSU and the rest of the league - through compromise; B1G and Super Best Friends aren't points of compromise, they're agenda driven institutions giving the finger to the rest of the league.
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Re: new super conference (NCHC)

Postby Armadillo » Sun 7/17/11 12:35 pm

jallengarry wrote:
dxmnkd316 wrote:Screw that. PSU can rot in hell. I don't mind them in most sports, always been a big fan of JoPa.

But what they did to college hockey, what they set in motion I can't forgive. They really did ruin everything that I held dear in college hockey. But whatever, all I care is to see the Gophers win when it's all said and done.


I don't know why I'm asking, but are you just venting or do you actually believe they should have stood back and said, "we'd like hockey but we don't want to mess things up for you guys"?


If I was in charge, PSU would be in the CCHA, and none of the rest of this nightmare would've had to happen.
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Re: new super conference (NCHC)

Postby g_manpucker » Sun 7/17/11 1:51 pm

Armadillo wrote:
jallengarry wrote:
dxmnkd316 wrote:Screw that. PSU can rot in hell. I don't mind them in most sports, always been a big fan of JoPa.

But what they did to college hockey, what they set in motion I can't forgive. They really did ruin everything that I held dear in college hockey. But whatever, all I care is to see the Gophers win when it's all said and done.


I don't know why I'm asking, but are you just venting or do you actually believe they should have stood back and said, "we'd like hockey but we don't want to mess things up for you guys"?


If I was in charge, PSU would be in the CCHA, and none of the rest of this nightmare would've had to happen.

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Re: new super conference (NCHC)

Postby Golden FE Ranger » Sun 7/17/11 2:05 pm

g_manpucker wrote:
Armadillo wrote:
jallengarry wrote:
dxmnkd316 wrote:Screw that. PSU can rot in hell. I don't mind them in most sports, always been a big fan of JoPa.

But what they did to college hockey, what they set in motion I can't forgive. They really did ruin everything that I held dear in college hockey. But whatever, all I care is to see the Gophers win when it's all said and done.


I don't know why I'm asking, but are you just venting or do you actually believe they should have stood back and said, "we'd like hockey but we don't want to mess things up for you guys"?


If I was in charge, PSU would be in the CCHA, and none of the rest of this nightmare would've had to happen.

DILLO FOR PRESIDENT!!!

I second that. I think that had their been some effort, the BigTen/12 could have worked within the existing structure of NCAA hockey to have space for conference games or even a great holiday tourney. That would have been preferable to me - rather than blowing up college hockey as we know it.
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Re: new super conference (NCHC)

Postby dxmnkd316 » Sun 7/17/11 2:10 pm

Golden FE Ranger wrote:
g_manpucker wrote:
Armadillo wrote:
jallengarry wrote:
dxmnkd316 wrote:Screw that. PSU can rot in hell. I don't mind them in most sports, always been a big fan of JoPa.

But what they did to college hockey, what they set in motion I can't forgive. They really did ruin everything that I held dear in college hockey. But whatever, all I care is to see the Gophers win when it's all said and done.


I don't know why I'm asking, but are you just venting or do you actually believe they should have stood back and said, "we'd like hockey but we don't want to mess things up for you guys"?


If I was in charge, PSU would be in the CCHA, and none of the rest of this nightmare would've had to happen.

DILLO FOR PRESIDENT!!!

I second that. I think that had their been some effort, the BigTen/12 could have worked within the existing structure of NCAA hockey to have space for conference games or even a great holiday tourney. That would have been preferable to me - rather than blowing up college hockey as we know it.


Oh come on guys. Quit whining. Get over it. :roll: :wink:
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Re: new super conference (NCHC)

Postby g_manpucker » Sun 7/17/11 2:19 pm

I was over it...then you got internet, started posting your feelings that have been bottled up for 4 months and now it's the only thing on my mind....oo, a butterfly! What was I saying? :mrgreen:
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Re: new super conference (NCHC)

Postby Melvin » Sun 7/17/11 7:13 pm

Hammy wrote:Seriously? Get over it. :roll:


Well then since the "almighty :censored: Hammy" has spoken I guess that ends it... :confused2: :shock:
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Re: new super conference (NCHC)

Postby Slap Shot » Sun 7/17/11 8:13 pm

Melvin wrote:
Hammy wrote:Seriously? Get over it. :roll:


Well then since the "almighty :censored: Hammy" has spoken I guess that ends it... :confused2: :shock:


Your personal problem with Hammy doesn't negate his point.
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Re: new super conference (NCHC)

Postby Tee09 » Sun 7/17/11 8:31 pm

Hopefully PSU does well enough to coax Illinois into adding a team. The Blackhawks have really increased interest there the last few years, and they seem like the only other Big Ten school likely to add a D-I team. Big school with a huge alumni base, especially in Chicago. Would be great if college hockey could be even marginally successful there.

Sometimes I wonder how many more teams there would be today if not for Title IX.
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Re: new super conference (NCHC)

Postby The Rube » Sun 7/17/11 8:51 pm

Slap Shot wrote:
Melvin wrote:
Hammy wrote:Seriously? Get over it. :roll:


Well then since the "almighty :censored: Hammy" has spoken I guess that ends it... :confused2: :shock:


Your personal problem with Hammy doesn't negate his point.


This is true. But just as the B1G Mistakers (and the ones who are "over it") are sick of the complainers, the complainers are sick of the people who keep telling them to get over it. :wink:

Haters gonna hate (yours truly included) for quite a while. This isn't just a team or two switching conferences. This is a total reshaping of 1/2 of D1 college hockey.
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Re: new super conference (NCHC)

Postby Armadillo » Sun 7/17/11 10:01 pm

The Rube wrote:
Slap Shot wrote:
Melvin wrote:
Hammy wrote:Seriously? Get over it. :roll:


Well then since the "almighty :censored: Hammy" has spoken I guess that ends it... :confused2: :shock:


Your personal problem with Hammy doesn't negate his point.


This is true. But just as the B1G Mistakers (and the ones who are "over it") are sick of the complainers, the complainers are sick of the people who keep telling them to get over it. :wink:

Haters gonna hate (yours truly included) for quite a while. This isn't just a team or two switching conferences. This is a total reshaping of 1/2 of D1 college hockey.


Especially for those of us whose favorite road trip has been Houghton, WHERE THE GOPHERS WILL NEVER GO AGAIN.

/bitter
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Re: new super conference (NCHC)

Postby thinkbui » Sun 7/17/11 10:28 pm

The Rube wrote:
Slap Shot wrote:
Melvin wrote:
Hammy wrote:Seriously? Get over it. :roll:


Well then since the "almighty :censored: Hammy" has spoken I guess that ends it... :confused2: :shock:


Your personal problem with Hammy doesn't negate his point.


This is true. But just as the B1G Mistakers (and the ones who are "over it") are sick of the complainers, the complainers are sick of the people who keep telling them to get over it. :wink:

Haters gonna hate (yours truly included) for quite a while. This isn't just a team or two switching conferences. This is a total reshaping of 1/2 of D1 college hockey.


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Re: new super conference (NCHC)

Postby MhdGopher » Sun 7/17/11 11:57 pm

The Rube wrote:This is true. But just as the B1G Mistakers (and the ones who are "over it") are sick of the complainers, the complainers are sick of the people who keep telling them to get over it. :wink:

Haters gonna hate (yours truly included) for quite a while. This isn't just a team or two switching conferences. This is a total reshaping of 1/2 of D1 college hockey.


Let's make a deal then. You don't complain....and the rest of us won't tell you to get over it.
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Re: new super conference (NCHC)

Postby The Rube » Mon 7/18/11 12:03 am

MhdGopher wrote:
The Rube wrote:This is true. But just as the B1G Mistakers (and the ones who are "over it") are sick of the complainers, the complainers are sick of the people who keep telling them to get over it. :wink:

Haters gonna hate (yours truly included) for quite a while. This isn't just a team or two switching conferences. This is a total reshaping of 1/2 of D1 college hockey.


Let's make a deal then. You don't complain....and the rest of us won't tell you to get over it.


I can't do that. I won't blindly complain or whine. I'll present other options that PSU/rest of western hockey should have pursued, as the developments continue, but I won't stop complaining overall.

BTW, funny how the rumor was that the WCHA wasn't an option for NMU before (and UNO got the invite) but now NMU is a shoo-in...I'da charged them to join (if they haven't been charged a fee, haven't read into it).
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Re: new super conference (NCHC)

Postby Golden FE Ranger » Mon 7/18/11 7:45 am

MhdGopher wrote:
The Rube wrote:This is true. But just as the B1G Mistakers (and the ones who are "over it") are sick of the complainers, the complainers are sick of the people who keep telling them to get over it. :wink:

Haters gonna hate (yours truly included) for quite a while. This isn't just a team or two switching conferences. This is a total reshaping of 1/2 of D1 college hockey.


Let's make a deal then. You don't complain....and the rest of us won't tell you to get over it.


Here is a thought: if there are people who don't care to hear both sides of the issue, they could easily avoid seeing the "complaining" by avoiding the threads on the subjects. Otherwise, I would suggest that the reader be prepared to hear opinions both for and against the upcoming changes. Both are valid, IMO.
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Re: new super conference (NCHC)

Postby Chris Eckes » Mon 7/18/11 8:33 am

Nobody answered this question before when I posted it: what is everyone's beef with Bruce McLeod? I don't have any preconceived notions on this one way or another, I'm just curious as I haven't heard anything about why people don't like him.
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Re: new super conference (NCHC)

Postby SouthTexGopher » Mon 7/18/11 9:33 am

The X Factor wrote:Nobody answered this question before when I posted it: what is everyone's beef with Bruce McLeod? I don't have any preconceived notions on this one way or another, I'm just curious as I haven't heard anything about why people don't like him.


I don't know the guy...I've never met him and I have no strong feelings on him.

That said, I've heard and read people say that he sat on his hands while the WCHA began to fall apart. From 2000 miles away, it's hard to debate that.


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Re: new super conference (NCHC)

Postby Five-HoleFrenzy » Mon 7/18/11 10:00 am

MCleod has some baggage from his past (Allegations of "mismanaged" athletic department funds at UMD which were which were found to be true). Look up info from articles in 1996 and you will see that there are good reasons for him to have stepped down as commissioner.
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Re: new super conference (NCHC)

Postby Dances With Gophers » Mon 7/18/11 10:12 am

Suddenly, it all makes sense: "ND produces enough sugarbeets that produce enough sugar to sweeten 27 billion gallons of Kool-Aid." ND Fun Facts Image :ahhh:

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Re: new super conference (NCHC)

Postby st8ofhockey » Mon 7/18/11 10:44 am

Dances With Gophers wrote:Case in point: http://www.intermatwrestle.com/articles/5657


Or you can see my post in pg 2 of this thread :D :wink:
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Re: new super conference (NCHC)

Postby SkiUMahLaw » Mon 7/18/11 3:35 pm

SouthTexGopher wrote:I don't know the guy...I've never met him and I have no strong feelings on him.

That said, I've heard and read people say that he sat on his hands while the WCHA began to fall apart. From 2000 miles away, it's hard to debate that.


Sure. But by the same token (and to continue the discussion), how is the WCHA supposed to compete with the B1G? You simply cannot, and McLeod is no idiot-- he knew that he couldn't stop the B1G from taking MN and WI when it came down with an edict to protect Penn State. His option at that time was to permit the B1G to play more games against one another-- however, at the expense of more games against conference competition? That would mean the B1G schools wouldn't play as many conference games, I suppose-- which is untenable to even keep a conference at that spot. The math simply doesn't work. And if you expect that MN and WI are supposed to keep all of their nonconference games simply for B1G, well, that isn't going to work either. At the end of the day, I can only assume he did what he could in the face of a Toyota versus a Freight Train-- you get out of the way and live to play another day.

Being realistic, you cannot compete with a media deal when the real media driver (Minnesota) and another of the top three (Wisconsin) are both going to be called by the B1G. So what is he supposed to do? Require that UND share some of their media revenue with WI to keep Bucky happy? Yeah, that would go over well.

At the end of the day, some people's (I am looking at those in Grand Forks here) expectations of McLeod appear to be unrealistic. About the best thing he could hope for was to protect the WCHA's existing revenue stream in keeping the Final Five at the X and seeking to protect all the conference's home game income in potentially getting a scheduling arrangement with B1G schools. But the idea that he could, given the tools he had and has at his disposal, talk MN and WI out of the B1G is completely laughable.

Being fair to him also, the UMD wrestling situation, while tragic and illustrative of some shady stuff, has very little bearing on his role of commissioner. It is not a very flattering view toward him, but at the same time, there have been no allegations that he has done anything even close to that in the WCHA.

While some have made the claim that the WCHA has been able to succeed in spite of him, (and, to an extent I agree-- the WCHA has done very well for itself over the past 10 years)-- it is really one-sided not to give him any credit to putting the conference in this position 15 years ago. It was the assimilation of St. Cloud State, UAA and Mankato in the 1990s-- not to mention absorbing the loss of Northern Michigan in 1997-- that made the conference what it is now, which all principally occurred under his watch. Not to mention, forming a dominant women's conference that has seen one of three member schools win EVERY women's national championship to date-- again, that is impressive. Hard to say if all of that was in his master plan, but in fairness to him-- since it happened under his watch (and he didn't screw it up), he deserves some credit.

It sounds like I really like McLeod-- in truth, I have never even met him and don't really know much about him other than what I have read or seen in interviews. But this whole thing of making him out to be the bad guy here just doesn't make much sense without any evidence of true mismanagement or a reprise of the UMD wrestling situation. And that has not occurred.

Again, part of me thinks the McLeod situation is all a UND conspiracy to try to claim a bigger share of the pie in ways that the BSUs and MTUs could not afford. As such, they wanted him gone because he was likely sticking up for the little guys and a historical, even share between teams. Does that mean I think that he deserves more time? No-- I leave that to the discretion of the conference teams. But the fact that none other than UND and apparently DU called for his head does address the remainder of the conference's feelings about him.
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Re: new super conference (NCHC)

Postby SouthTexGopher » Mon 7/18/11 4:04 pm

As with many of your posts, that's a well-thought out and detailed response. You should consider a career in law or something. :)

My point on him doing nothing really wasn't related to trying to keep Minnesota and Wisconsin from leaving the WCHA for the greener pasture$ of the B1G. It was more about the fact that he didn't do anything to try and add schools to the conference to replace them. The WCHA easily could have ended up as a five-team conference without an auto-bid. That's not going to happen now...but (again, from my spot 2000 miles to the south) it sure seemed for a while like it was possible.


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